The Longing of Shiina Ryo

[mythu]

I tried to find the best expressing of my ability but I too lack a lot in finding the right words. These are my insights and I am sorry if I ovelooked something as human beings we (almost) all are. I don't really consider competitions or adversities, I think it would have been best for all if all had a common share.
I "coincidentally?" happened to be the first one(on Baka-Tsuki) that read all your materials, even now Vol 3 chap 2 said: this page has been accessed once.
I just needed 2 days of poundering to gather and materialise my toughts.

Spoiler! :

I kind of figured out Kouma's time-dream memory projection ability
To experience then project it back as a glimse of profecy through her's previsious dreaming making it lucid-like and as a different dimension lucid presentation not breaking any of the time-travel taboos.
Or neither of all the natural laws of the universe that a bound to be respected, but not ussually by people's imagining and wildly experimenting their interpretations.
Haven't found any abnormalities with Shin-Tzu and Kizuna Jun either and I haven't payed a good attention to the others.
As for now all characters seem to me interesting and lovable.
What I can understand about Kouma are: her desires to fully use her abilities for the whole's well being, realized that the more she exposes the more Koukishin becomes of an uncontrolled variable and the more her fears to be separated and be alone are "eating" her.
This because she doesn't want to fail her equal contribution in the groups ballance of friendship.(the offer and receive). Koukishin made her feel limited where (at) she tought to be the best.
She sees herself as an extremely low value, rightfully putting the other 2 before her and she thinks to bring a greater contribution to restore the ballance so all of them return to be toghether.
She doesn't have a fault because she wasn't taught to treat everybody(including herself in this case) as an equal value.
She felt from the very start cast aside and wanted to add Shin-tsu to her protecting list(close to storge love). She wants to dominate so she doesn't lose control. She and Shin-tzu are best at keeping relationships through domination and manipulation and small pieces of "Storge" love.
And as a matter of fact none of the main trio weren't nurtured with their legitim needs of parental love.
Their relationship cannot evolve and cannot find a proper ballance, so that none of the 3 would be significally affected, because their needed normal growth that had to start with a loving parental relation.
Therefore all of them had to find shelter in the world's public(written) morals and philosophies and build their own principles without any assisted guidance. But love can be best learned through emotional experience and would hardly be recognizable otherwise.
Without a proper love growth and experience, we develop with cripples in our dignity. It's terrifying how their caring is stronger than a ordinary developed one, this implying people need both love and action.
SO I'd expect another character appearance that realized and attained a proper growth(even if not from the start) willing to experience with them their longings of a decent ballanced life.(even if danger continues to come their unity and cooperation should be strong)

Spoiler! :

Regarding the process of writing, your toughts on the novel evolve too fast compared to you writing, noticed from Shin-tsu's "monologues" rising too fast in difficulty (of understanding).
I can point this earnest writing flaw of yours: the novel doesn't target all or most of the people, only the experienced readers.
Sometimes I read up to 3-5 times a part of a phrase to grasp it and sometimes I can only get the essential message of a whole phrase.
But I love your novel, you are an excellent (unedited works) writer that also does not do things half way. The editor must also be updated on your writing goals and tasks.
I hope in doing the right thing in advicing you to build progressive reading exercises so a beginner reader can be trained to grasp the whole novel.
In other words if you find some possibillities to gradually raise(maintain, raise) the difficulty of the trasmitted messages it would exponetially raise your readers range ..and number.
While in the meantime the readers find out their reading abilities(insight and of course maturity) have been improved and..let's hope that all sides will be grateful.
Please all do update me on the possible errors I have overlooked.

[Ryuno]

I tried to find the best expressing of my ability but I too lack a lot in finding the right words. These are my insights and I am sorry if I ovelooked something as human beings we (almost) all are. I don't really consider competitions or adversities, I think it would have been best for all if all had a common share.
I "coincidentally?" happened to be the first one(on Baka-Tsuki) that read all your materials, even now Vol 3 chap 2 said: this page has been accessed once.
I just needed 2 days of poundering to gather and materialise my toughts.

Spoiler! :

I kind of figured out Kouma's time-dream memory projection ability
To experience then project it back as a glimse of profecy through her's previsious dreaming making it lucid-like and as a different dimension lucid presentation not breaking any of the time-travel taboos.
Or neither of all the natural laws of the universe that a bound to be respected, but not ussually by people's imagining and wildly experimenting their interpretations.
Haven't found any abnormalities with Shin-Tzu and Kizuna Jun either and I haven't payed a good attention to the others.
As for now all characters seem to me interesting and lovable.
What I can understand about Kouma are: her desires to fully use her abilities for the whole's well being, realized that the more she exposes the more Koukishin becomes of an uncontrolled variable and the more her fears to be separated and be alone are "eating" her.
This because she doesn't want to fail her equal contribution in the groups ballance of friendship.(the offer and receive). Koukishin made her feel limited where (at) she tought to be the best.
She sees herself as an extremely low value, rightfully putting the other 2 before her and she thinks to bring a greater contribution to restore the ballance so all of them return to be toghether.
She doesn't have a fault because she wasn't taught to treat everybody(including herself in this case) as an equal value.
She felt from the very start cast aside and wanted to add Shin-tsu to her protecting list(close to storge love). She wants to dominate so she doesn't lose control. She and Shin-tzu are best at keeping relationships through domination and manipulation and small pieces of "Storge" love.
And as a matter of fact none of the main trio weren't nurtured with their legitim needs of parental love.
Their relationship cannot evolve and cannot find a proper ballance, so that none of the 3 would be significally affected, because their needed normal growth that had to start with a loving parental relation.
Therefore all of them had to find shelter in the world's public(written) morals and philosophies and build their own principles without any assisted guidance. But love can be best learned through emotional experience and would hardly be recognizable otherwise.
Without a proper love growth and experience, we develop with cripples in our dignity. It's terrifying how their caring is stronger than a ordinary developed one, this implying people need both love and action.
SO I'd expect another character appearance that realized and attained a proper growth(even if not from the start) willing to experience with them their longings of a decent ballanced life.(even if danger continues to come their unity and cooperation should be strong)

Spoiler! :

Regarding the process of writing, your toughts on the novel evolve too fast compared to you writing, noticed from Shin-tsu's "monologues" rising too fast in difficulty (of understanding).
I can point this earnest writing flaw of yours: the novel doesn't target all or most of the people, only the experienced readers.
Sometimes I read up to 3-5 times a part of a phrase to grasp it and sometimes I can only get the essential message of a whole phrase.
But I love your novel, you are an excellent (unedited works) writer that also does not do things half way. The editor must also be updated on your writing goals and tasks.
I hope in doing the right thing in advicing you to build progressive reading exercises so a beginner reader can be trained to grasp the whole novel.
In other words if you find some possibillities to gradually raise(maintain, raise) the difficulty of the trasmitted messages it would exponetially raise your readers range ..and number.
While in the meantime the readers find out their reading abilities(insight and of course maturity) have been improved and..let's hope that all sides will be grateful.
Please all do update me on the possible errors I have overlooked.

Bravo. I'm clapping, grinning and on the verge of tears here. Downright euphoric. Thank you, thank you so much. It fills me with joy, to get such a detailed and well-thought analysis; this is like Christmas to me!

I can't clarify how right or wrong you might be regarding Kouma's ability; however, you made a fine point in stating the only way a "power" like that could exist would be warping or transcending the "laws" of the universe. Now, about the familiar influence (or rather, lack-thereof) on their behavior, values and moral systems, you hit the mark like a true sniper. Absolutely, completely right; the modern world is more open to alternative models of "family" and while that is a more realistic view than to expect everyone to have functioning roles of provider/hunter for a father and a administrator/gatherer for a mother, it doesn't change the fact such a change is sure to affect society in more ways than one: tropes become tropes because they work, and it's not too big a stretch to say the practice of leaving the children to themselves will most likely result in internalized thought processes that ultimately will differ from those of other members of society because the conjectures of each side will not be considering the other's. Individuality and preference, at the end of the day those are biases too; not to say they are bad, there is value in "flaws" as much as there is value in so-called "virtues". However, as it's scheduled for another microchapter in this first part of the story, if someone teaches a kid "wrong", there's no telling what that will do to them. Say your son does something you would never do, shoplift or something, and you "allow it" by not being aware of what happened or not doing enough about it, or even doing too much? We don't know where that will end. He might go through traumatic experiences and become a better person. He might go deeper into the crime life. He might grow out of it but remain bitter. We don't know, but I'll tell you what he won't become: you. The values you didn't teach or taught them wrong, the times you didn't listen to him when he needed you to, the moments when you let your personal issues get in the way of bonding, that's when human nature kicks in: explore, investigate, experience, learn. And if you at least taught him how to learn, the chances of him surviving the learning process are greater. If not, well, we'll have to hope for the best.

Kids get in relationships before they learn who they are nowadays, and there's no stopping them from it because they will seek for what they don't have. Hormones aside, the main reason why people bond or get into cults is over what they lack in their lives; love, friendship, comprehension. There is a demand and so they search for suppliers, simple as that. The quantity or quality of the product, the price they pay... all that is variable. Those who find the equilibrium between needing something and filtering out what they don't are what we call "adults". Such a person is the "true main character".

Regarding the writing issue, that is all true too. I have been raising the bar and need to tone it down at some points, give people a moment to breathe; my natural tendency is to start on what appears to be simple and then gradually go for over-the-top stuff, which I don't really think is wrong in concept but if the execution is lacking there's no point. It's just the anxiety of getting to the parts of the story I really want to share, I guess; it takes a lot of self-restraint because I would need several years to get there writing stuff on my own even if I were half as diligent as NisiOisiN... I desperately need to learn to write faster or these stories will consume me. Once again, thank you.

epub

Going to try and find a good converter for that, need something that keeps the formatting properly.

[mythu]

..give people a moment to breathe..or these stories will consume me

It looked like you skipped yourself on "people"...and us at the "me" part.
One could sometimes take his precious time off and do effectively nothing, except listening in the spaciously unlimited open nature; sometimes one with one could do noisy and relieving childish activities.(posibilities do not stop here as long as your dig ways to fill your emotional tank, we feed on emotions) After one returns, one may surely regard all issues less stressing and affecting and will see them with a lighter light.(healthier or restored vision)
How in the world these unusual paths connect adulthood and childhood and restore their proper ratio ballance none should wonder but rather first enjoy them to the fullest. When grown people regard normal behavior as eccentric they may have forgotten their child within themselves. They should never forget an individual has the rights to regard any eccentric, life non-threatening behavior as a normal one. The individual must always remember the limitless outraging practices must be usually done outside high dignity periods of time or areas(good populated). Even in a park ppl usually come there to be free from most of the noise. But a master-level can still make the noise and disturb no crowds but rather astonish their beliefs on how can such things can be done with dignity. Lol @ why do most movies regard the advanced criminal minds the only ones suitable, these ppl are wrongly experimenting "their child" and at an too extreme level, they had to forget to dream and to hope and we take responsability for the neighbour's outcomings because we ignored their and our (common) needs.
ONE should never let himself be consumed, at least at a dangerous level.
Why feel down, normally there should not be any regret when doing the best you can. We all have the unending journey to perfect ourselves.

Spoiler! :

And about Kouma's ability I pointed the simple similarity to that of the old prophets but we know it's about more than visual and hearing data transfers. Kouma is not a good liar, lying is not in her custom.
"..I moved back in time..<AND>..her power was to predict the future and ‘expel’ the script for someone" should be both truth
Also to better understand is to observe the different domains(virtual worlds, artificial intelligences, dreaming, even our thinking) that can be found connected to a universe. It is a part of the universe and yet it isn't. These aren't part of the material universe and could be classified as different universes with different laws. There might be even more material universes, yet with different laws but it's quite the godly distance from our place.
For now there are unlimited directions to track an universe but not unlimited resources. In another direction: there are material universes within a master universe, master universes within a grand universe etc.
Also we know Sensei coudn't be (too) saved “You try and find me hiding within school grounds before your teacher bleeds to death.”. She was already bleeding.. and outside of Kouma's time-action domain. KEN tought she was still in battle.
“No, I’m sorry. You have the right to feel that way. I should have treated you as an equal and I apologize for not doing so." All of them are still learning to treat equally. As all of us. Merry holidays, my bro's and sis's

[Cryum]

Damnit, you guys are losing me with both Red Orchestra and your analysis' of children's identity and interactions with others.

Even now, I don't fully understand what the situation is now between Kouma, Shin-tsu and Ryo. All of them are biting of more than they can chew in their own ways. Shin-tsu with his battles with Mystery is forced to regularly enter a world with many sides, with most of them having conflicting interests with him. It doesn't help that he seems to be a magnet for people who like to mind-screw friends. With the Darkest, Shin-tsu is a person able to survive and solve these cases, but is also facing his own fears and dealing with trust issues every second of the way.

Kouma also has trust issues, but hers are more of a matter of controlling everything, and-alright screw it, I don't understand everything enough to make a passable analysis of all the characters. I'll just pass the time and enjoy the incredibly, meticulously complicated story here while it sorts itself out.

For all the analysis of children's psyche when you take away the parent figures or just use one-in-a-million personalities, I wonder what it's like if the real life abnormal children tried to read this.

Also, this novel is both trope overdosed AND reference overdosed. I can't believe I just read a Hakomari and minecraft reference in one sitting.

[mythu]

@Cryum

Spoiler! :

-I'll always prefer not to clash on individual identities, however collective identity is another story. I focus on understanding situations and interactions.
-The situation between the 3 is AKWARD partnership. But they are starting to tolerate each other's "flaws" and "virtues". They realized, more or less, that living and acting alone is not an option.
-KEN being a "magnet" may be a problem but also an advantage
-no one will ever be an all-knowing god and understand everything in one life but.. we can focus on what to understand, that which should draw us closer to fulfilling our indispensable needs. I do spend some of my points there.
"With the Darkest, Shin-tsu is a person able to survive" is not accurate. KEN rather survives through cooperation with other entities(usually people). It is possible to solve all cases through "soul- warfare" like he tried with Ayaka and Ryo, where he failed because he didn't know how to provide their needs, for them to regain their composure, he actually had to do it by force and with important help, Ayaka was then abandoned but Ryo is another story. (We can survive with the help of our CLOSE FRIENDS or universal family which we don't ussually aknowledge plus if we too make progress with accepting our inner self or our inner adjustor that is somewhat different form each of us)
Have you forgotten what I wrote regarding Kirito how he survives with cooperation and partnership?
-I was surprised too when I was reading, we aren't used with 2 difficult references in one setting, but all this is good feedback for Ryuno, he does want to make most of the story available to most readers.
-I don't limit but enlarge my viewing perspectives and am in constant care(even if it does not seem enough and don't want to be alone and am not, in this research) of my physical and mental health so I am a bit fortunate for realizing things earlier than others

@Ryuno
Have you made progress in understanding the name "NisiOisiN"?
I think you have a higher chance to get to know him if both of you are from a similar cultural experience.(his cultural sense is higher but you are or should be doing research on what he values, probably similar to what many other people values, his chosen name relates with his "core")
I also am an "adept fan" of culture and I am appreciating it's messages

[Ryuno]

My internet has been unstable the past two days and I lost posts twice already. Now I decided it would be in everyone’s best interest if I typed stuff on MS Word instead and just paste it later while it seems to be connected. Let’s just hope there isn’t another blackout, shall we?

It looked like you skipped yourself on "people"...and us at the "me" part.
One could sometimes take his precious time off and do effectively nothing, except listening in the spaciously unlimited open nature; sometimes one with one could do noisy and relieving childish activities.(posibilities do not stop here as long as your dig ways to fill your emotional tank, we feed on emotions) After one returns, one may surely regard all issues less stressing and affecting and will see them with a lighter light.(healthier or restored vision)
One could sometimes take his precious time off and do effectively nothing, except listening in the spaciously unlimited open nature; sometimes one with one could do noisy and relieving childish activities.(posibilities do not stop here as long as your dig ways to fill your emotional tank, we feed on emotions) After one returns, one may surely regard all issues less stressing and affecting and will see them with a lighter light.(healthier or restored vision)
How in the world these unusual paths connect adulthood and childhood and restore their proper ratio ballance none should wonder but rather first enjoy them to the fullest. When grown people regard normal behavior as eccentric they may have forgotten their child within themselves. They should never forget an individual has the rights to regard any eccentric, life non-threatening behavior as a normal one. The individual must always remember the limitless outraging practices must be usually done outside high dignity periods of time or areas(good populated). Even in a park ppl usually come there to be free from most of the noise. But a master-level can still make the noise and disturb no crowds but rather astonish their beliefs on how can such things can be done with dignity. Lol @ why do most movies regard the advanced criminal minds the only ones suitable, these ppl are wrongly experimenting "their child" and at an too extreme level, they had to forget to dream and to hope and we take responsability for the neighbour's outcomings because we ignored their and our (common) needs.
ONE should never let himself be consumed, at least at a dangerous level.

I see where you’re coming from, but I don’t think there is a need to worry about that; before I was the underachiever of today, I used to be a severely flawed overachiever. Flawed as in I would go all the way into whatever 20 projects I took on and be the last person to leave a sinking boat. I knew it wasn’t a good thing to be constantly overwhelmed by work yet there was no stopping me from taking more projects that ultimately brought me little gain, but only at the request of individuals close to me I had to take it easier and put stuff in hiatus or just abandon them. My threshold might have changed because most things I am actively interested in have been perceived as “too much” at one point; like Neuro, I am continuously growing weaker for the sake of emotional stability and my sanity. Taking a breather could work in other situations but every time I try it, it just turns out to become more stress due to already being on a low dosage of a “medicine” called “activity”. That said; I am putting a lot of effort into cultivating hobbies such as keeping e-book collections, composing, and catching up on movies, along with rewatching all things Tarantino whenever I can. The only thing I would personally add to that list would be playing videogames, which I hardly ever do; when I bother to, it’s always Chrono Trigger, SNES Shin Megami Tensei I & II, first two generations of Pokémon, Dark Duel Stories, Smash TV, Castlevania (especially Aria of Sorrow) or Gauntlet. Wish I could get into Touhou more so I wouldn’t be such a “secondary”. Or that I could play decent ports of Heroes Lore and Miami Nights: Singles in the City on my current phone. Oh well.

Thank you for your concern, but this is the best I can do to keep myself from becoming “too powerless”, if that’s even a thing. A little more human is fine though, and it’s a theme in the novel as well. But, once again, the points you spoiler-tagged are close enough to the very marrow of the bone for me to avoid comment on in order not to just give the whole thing away. Don’t take this the wrong way, it means you are putting a lot of thought in it.
Damnit, you guys are losing me with both Red Orchestra and your analysis' of children's identity and interactions with others.

Even now, I don't fully understand what the situation is now between Kouma, Shin-tsu and Ryo. All of them are biting of more than they can chew in their own ways. Shin-tsu with his battles with Mystery is forced to regularly enter a world with many sides, with most of them having conflicting interests with him. It doesn't help that he seems to be a magnet for people who like to mind-screw friends. With the Darkest, Shin-tsu is a person able to survive and solve these cases, but is also facing his own fears and dealing with trust issues every second of the way.

Kouma also has trust issues, but hers are more of a matter of controlling everything, and-alright screw it, I don't understand everything enough to make a passable analysis of all the characters. I'll just pass the time and enjoy the incredibly, meticulously complicated story here while it sorts itself out.

For all the analysis of children's psyche when you take away the parent figures or just use one-in-a-million personalities, I wonder what it's like if the real life abnormal children tried to read this.

Also, this novel is both trope overdosed AND reference overdosed. I can't believe I just read a Hakomari and minecraft reference in one sitting.

Relationships can be very complicated when people hold back because not everyone can guess the others’ feelings and concerns. Conflicts are bound to happen and if they are left unsolved they expand and combine with other issues until they become massive snowballs the Earth could gravitate around; yes, indeed, problems that start with the lack of proper communication can become bigger than the world itself.

Also, not bragging, but I’ve lost nights of sleep over how complicated this gets. The only reason why this book is not at the top of my priority list for NaNoWriMo 2012 is that it doesn’t seem to get considerably easier after outlining and getting an extensive amount of notes in both paper and digital mediums. Only when I considered it I remembered why I absolutely had to write The Longing of Shiina Ryo before The Darkest: to tell people “read the manual” when they think a situation or a behavioral pattern requires a previous example to establish character/motivation. Really, really tricky stuff.
Cyul did a great job at going out of his way to reference all things interesting to keep the same style, probably because I told him it was alright for the story to be canon. Just to clarify things, he wrote the story and I worked as a scenario, or rather, SCENARIO-consultant to keep it all nice, smooth and clean to the point of foreshadowing things; for this reason, I wanted to do more and try to edit before release and this is why it was taking so long, but I figured except for a couple typos there was no need to because you guys can do a better job than me. Made me a little shy of adding to the afterword, not a fan the idea of stealing someone else’s thunder; he did a fine job and the only reason why I put my name along with his was because he requested so and it’ s a good way for people to understand its contents can be taken as seriously as Metamonogatari at the very least. It was a very pleasant experience and I personally would love to work with him again in a near future, especially if it’s that prison story we almost fully outlined in one sitting. Good times.

Gilles’ story was more of a free process (as in there wasn’t a lot of consulting going on) but it also foreshadows some things. Plus, you know you didn’t live until

Spoiler! :

Megumi asks if your boobs got bigger

so yeah.

Have you made progress in understanding the name "NisiOisiN"?
I think you have a higher chance to get to know him if both of you are from a similar cultural experience.(his cultural sense is higher but you are or should be doing research on what he values, probably similar to what many other people values, his chosen name relates with his "core")
I also am an "adept fan" of culture and I am appreciating it's messages

I can understand “him” a little better now, as I’m sure he’d be able to figure “me” out a little better if he read my work. There’s only so far we can go by that, however, so if it can be helped I’d like to at least exchange e-mails with him and Araki as I’m sure we could all talk about morals and old movies for quite a while, and even if I was wrong, it wouldn’t change my perception of their work in the slightest. When reading their work, I was under the impression it was tailor-made for individuals such as me; however, fully aware of that being a fallacy, I have to commend them on selling me that illusion. After all, “the greatest entertainer is the greatest swindler”, right? Well, call me Danny Blue then, ‘cause I’m hellbent on learning from these guys.

It's always good to meet someone who understands/appreciates the value of culture. Let's do our best together.

[mythu]

I feel you, it's hard to constantly guard yourself(and your areas, domains..) so that things don't go too complicated and even overboard. But this is the Action we'd gladly head into.

[Ryuno]

Just an update: I will try to finish the third novel during this year's NaNoWriMo. As some of you know, this volume is going to be the end of this part of the story, which would be the prelude to the main series, The Darkest; therefore, in a sense this is both an ending and a beginning, which means it will most likely be hell to write. Way too many characters to handle, especially for someone used to going through a whole novel with only a handful of them, too many subplots and point-of-views...

...I'm guessing it will be fun too.

[mythu]

Hell to write especially on the easy-flowing-to-read part.(I think, only if the narrator is other(The Darkest?) than Shin-tsu, unless he undergoes a new special experience that can train his narrating ability, but doubt me on this, I might be the only one with thinking on the more easy-flowing-to-read need)
BTW this reminds me of Kyubi and Naruto. Now Naruto can switch places with Kurama just like Killer Bee with his "eight-tails".
Or a meeting scene where all 3 protagonists inner powers get to openly talk with each other while the 3 children step in observation mode.(if the powers get fully accepted in the end, but they still have major trusting issues)
Keep up the better work! I am enjoying it.

[Ryuno]

Glad you're enjoying it, just passed by to let you guys know I'm doing my best to get volume 3 done before the end of the year. Which is, of course, very unlikely. Still, the OST is coming along nicely!

https://soundcloud.com/ryunocore/ars-finita