Spoiler! :
Like I said, don't blame the system just because the ruler is no good (going by that basis, I also can blame democracy).ainsoph9 wrote:That argument would work if it was not for the fact that the imams are virtually in control of these countries. I am not talking about the princes of Saudia Arabia, who go to the West to party and then come home to look like saints again. While it is true that there is mass corruption in many Middle Eastern and Islamic countries, it is the conservative sects of Islam that are taking over these countries.
I'm not talking about the terrorist, I'm talking about a real war between the Jews army (or rather, Israel army most likely) and Islam nearing the End of Days. That's what the Hadith talking about.ainsoph9 wrote:Your analogy would work, except for the fact that United States Army generals do not hide behind women and children and target innocents intentionally. They also do not target buses, civilian cars, schools, hospitals, and places that have no strategic or tactical impact on a war whatsoever. Terrorists do that. These terrorists have stated and made it their mission to wipe out all Jews and Christians. They have threatened to push Israel into the Mediterranean Sea. So, the analogy does not work.
Islam also have many organizations devoted to building ties with other religions. And the majority of the world also have a problem with a Jewish regime using rhetoric to claim Palestine as their lands. And Islam never teach to annihilate Jewish people, a leader of HAMAS said, "We're not fighting Israel because they're Jews, we're fighting them because they take our lands. If my brother does the same thing, I will also fight him".ainsoph9 wrote:Most Jews have no problem with Muslims. Many Jewish organizations are devoted to building ties with other religions, Islam included. However, Jews do have a problem with people do suicide bombings to kill innocent Jews in the name of Islam. They do have a problem with Islamic regimes using rhetoric that calls for the destruction of Israel and the annihilation of the Jewish people.
"Israel's attitude for the last 60+ years" has nothing to do with this. Israel is a small country that is just trying to survive.
Don't prolong this matter any longer, since this is what we're debating about in the first place.
Open http://ifamericansknew.org/history/orig ... #terrorism.ainsoph9 wrote:What is so vile about what the Israeli government is doing? Please give evidence.
ainsoph9 wrote:You are taking history out of context. During the Muslim conquest, Jews and Christians were forced to convert to Islam at sword-point. Those who did not convert were killed in droves. Those that did convert were allowed to live, but they had to live in conditions that deprived them of many of their rights and freedoms. So, if Israel "joined" the Islamic Empire, it was not by choice.
You're wrong. Islam never force others to convert. Rather, at that time, they're given two choice, to convert or to live in peace by paying tax (it's not much). Obviously, most of them chose the latter.
"Following the Muslim conquest of Jerusalem, Jews were once again allowed to live and practice their religion with more freedom in Jerusalem, 8 years after their massacre by the Byzantines and nearly 500 years after their expulsion from Judea by the Roman Empire." - Wikipedia
For historical matters, I'll just direct you to this, http://ifamericansknew.org/history/origin.html (I'm tired arguing over every little things).
It's my mistake again it seems. The only army involved is British, but they're using the name of the Allies.ainsoph9 wrote:The only Ally involved besides the Dutch were the British from what I have seen. Do you have proof for otherwise?
Like I said for historical matters and origins, go to the link I gave you.ainsoph9 wrote:Again, your analogy fails because it assumes upon the idea that the Palestinians are 1) native to the land, 2) have been there before the Jews ever were there, and 3) you are equating Israel to imperialism. All three of these are wholly false.
If you really disagree with these terrorism, then why do you condone the ideals of these terrorists? Why do you not condemn their actions and do something about it when people are losing their lives?
I can blame them and I do blame them. The hatred is generational. Therefore, it has to be taught. Parents and teachers can choose to teach their children not to hate and blame the Jews and Israel for all of their live's woes. They do not do that. Textbooks in Area A and across the Middle East teach hatred of the Jews and Israel. Maps in classrooms do not have Israel on the map. Children are taught to say that they will become martyrs for the cause of killing Jews and destroying Israel. Every year the Palestinians and Arab world hold Nakba Day, which is in remembrance of Israel becoming a nation and them supposedly losing the land. Almost every year it ends in bloody riots or stone-throwing. This year was no different. My point is that these people have a choice. They are choosing the path of hatred. They are making the wrong choice.
And I condemn terrorism, and I also condemn imperialism. And I really think that Israel is an invader and practicing imperialism, in addition of terrorism and genocide to some degree (again, refer to my link).
I thought we're talking about Gaza and Palestinians...ainsoph9 wrote:All of Israel is for Israelis. I do not know know what you are talking about otherwise.
On the contrary. Just visit this for more information, http://ifamericansknew.org/ainsoph9 wrote:What you are not saying here is that almost all of these children were not killed by Israelis. Rather, they were killed because they were transporting munitions or sleeping in bunkers full of munitions. Others have been killed accidentally in the line of fire because terrorists used them as human shields. There also has been a few cases were Israeli missiles missed their target and hit the wrong building among a whole city of buildings. In each one of these cases, Israel has reformed their training for their soldiers and worked to improve the technology for subduing terrorists without the loss of life.
One the other hand, all 129 Israeli children have been killed by Palestinian terrorists, who deliberately blew up school buses, restaurants, shopping malls, and public places. These children were not carrying weapons. They were not sleeping on munitions, and Israeli soldiers did not use them as human shields. The comparison you are making is missing many of the facts. Ergo, it is not a true and just comparison.
The economy really did get better after the last Gaza War it seems. But before that, they're always on decline. And they still got blockade at the moment...ainsoph9 wrote:Here is one.
Heck, even Wikipedia has an article.
There are plenty more places on the internet. Just Google "olympic pool Gaza."
That would be true, if only those five countries were the wisest, most righteous, and thinking of the good for the rest of the world when they make the decision, in addition of being immune to any political and financial greed.ainsoph9 wrote:The role of the veto was originally to prevent actions from occurring that could be potentially harmful to a group as a whole, including those who would disagree with the veto. The veto is a part of the United States Constitution as part of the checks-and-balances system. The result has often been that it leads to better and tighter laws that are better written. While sometimes the veto is politically motivated, it can be a powerful tool to prevent corruption in the right hands, which is its original intention.
As for your examples, I am not going to pick them apart because this discussion is getting way too lengthy.
Sadly, that is not the case. Now, now, it's normal for any country to only thinking about theirs when they make a decision, and that's how the world works. But at the very least, don't call it democracy please.
"According to Princeton University professor emeritus of international law Richard Falk, there exists an "overwhelming consensus" view among qualified international law specialists that both the blockade and its enforcement are illegal." - Wikipediaainsoph9 wrote:Again, the way that these flotillas behave is for publicity. Almost all of them to date have made press releases to make it known what they are doing, which has provoked the Israeli government to action.
The way to make supplies go into Gaza is simple. Hand it over to the Egyptian or Israeli authorities or land in Egypt with your supplies and make the land crossing yourself in Gaza. Remember. Egypt opened the land border with Gaza for crossing. So, if these flotillas really were concerned about the "humanitary crisis in Gaza," they would do that. Instead, they choose to violate a legal blockage on Gaza, which indicates that their motives lie somewhere in trying to violate Israel's sovereignty as a nation.
Israel is a legal country, and is recognized as one by nations worldwide. Even if other countries did not recognize them, identity is defined from within not without.
Blockade is never legal to begin with, which is why the try to break through it. And Israel is not a nation in the first place. Even if they're, they won't be a good one anyway.
It's because not all Jews support Zionism, like those recorded here. And also the links given by Hiro Hayase.ainsoph9 wrote:Thank you for showing me your contempt for Israel once again by basically calling it the "Zionist entity." My sources include classes, seminars, the internet, etc. I tend not to rely on news sources because they tend to be more slanted than helpful.
But my real concern is, you can't stigmatize that the other's sources is wrong without actually specifying which part is wrong and prove it. If that is allowed, every debate participants will just dismissed the other's sources and statistics as invalid.
Lastly, as an American, don't you feel anything knowing your taxes is spent for this?
Thanks for helping me exercise my mind.
because your charges are just so insane that that is about all I can do at this point.
