ばか！バカ！　馬鹿ー月！

YoakeNoHikari wrote:

HexOmega wrote:Very. very true. It is sad that the general public can't discern between "music" and "noise" these days.

And I can very easily say that you have shit taste. So, what logical, rational, and objective argument can you use to convince me that what you listen to is music and what the general public listens to is noise?

I am very sorry you took it that way, but please do not assume I am being illogical. To start, I could compare musical complexity (using different meter, uncommon chord patterns, the syncopation of the song, and things that require a mastery or at least deep understanding of ones instrument.) I could next move into the way something becomes mainstream and gets money, which is a heck of a lot more political and bureaucratic then musical in any way (get endorsed by some big company, sign up with the right record label as long as you let them use your music however you want...etc) A large amount of pop-music is based on heavy synth and auto-tuning, which personally, is a lot more computer based then music in any way. A majority of "music icons"(I can site later if you truly wish) no longer even write their songs, so they act as a puppet to a larger picture in order to cash a check. I believe that music should be based on what one truly feels (and expresses through their own songs) as opposed to just reading words on a page and having a man auto tune your voice. So yes, you can call my music shit, as that is your own opinion and you are indeed entitled to have it, but I simply believe otherwise.

Anyone?

Added: Love the "When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk...." part.

HexOmega wrote: I am very sorry you took it that way, but please do not assume I am being illogical. I could next move into the way something becomes mainstream and gets money, which is a heck of a lot more political and bureaucratic then musical in any way (get endorsed by some big company, sign up with the right record label as long as you let them use your music however you want...etc) A large amount of pop-music is based on heavy synth and auto-tuning, which personally, is a lot more computer based then music in any way. A majority of "music icons"(I can site later if you truly wish) no longer even write their songs, so they act as a puppet to a larger picture in order to cash a check. I believe that music should be based on what one truly feels (and expresses through their own songs) as opposed to just reading words on a page and having a man auto tune your voice. So yes, you can call my music shit, as that is your own opinion and you are indeed entitled to have it, but I simply believe otherwise.

I don't even know why I'm going to waste my time writing this post, except I have this overwhelming need to try and convince someone that what you're saying is stupid:

To start, I could compare musical complexity (using different meter, uncommon chord patterns, the syncopation of the song, and things that require a mastery or at least deep understanding of ones instrument.)

The day when syncopation is needed to make music complex is the day art dies. What the hell is an uncommon chord pattern? I can play uncommon chord patterns all day long and it'll end up dissonant, and sounding like crap. If you're going to bandy music technique with me, I cite the first movement of the Moonlight Sonata as a piece with very little syncopation, and chord progression that might have come out of a textbook. But I suppose it isn't complex enough for your tastes.

I could next move into the way something becomes mainstream and gets money, which is a heck of a lot more political and bureaucratic then musical in any way (get endorsed by some big company, sign up with the right record label as long as you let them use your music however you want...etc)

Ah...yes, being mainstream and doing all the above voids your work from being music. Because music really needs good intentions behind it to be music, and bureaucracy is just so cold and soulless, how can any music that's mainstream be real music?

A large amount of pop-music is based on heavy synth and auto-tuning, which personally, is a lot more computer based then music in any way.

My God, did you just suggest that anything made from a computer isn't music? I suggest you think over that statement before trying yo convince me in a logical manner using it.

A majority of "music icons"(I can site later if you truly wish) no longer even write their songs, so they act as a puppet to a larger picture in order to cash a check. I believe that music should be based on what one truly feels (and expresses through their own songs) as opposed to just reading words on a page and having a man auto tune your voice.

I suppose that the lyrics which the singer didn't write were randomly generated by a computer. No creative effort or endeavour necessary. You just said you 'believe', so you're already moving away from rationality and appealing to my morality and emotion. Auto-tuning is hard work, why shouldn't it be music?

Yeah. You have failed to make me respect your viewpoint through supported statements.

Hex, stop, please, I'd write a reply on your behalf, but neither of you will ever agree.

I believe we should look at the base definition of music (according to Merriam-Webster):

• 1a : the science or art of ordering tones or sounds in succession, in combination, and in temporal relationships to produce a composition having unity and continuity
  b : vocal, instrumental, or mechanical sounds having rhythm, melody, or harmony

Both of you are wrong and both of you are right. I'll leave it at that.

Here, calm yourselves:
All parties agree the above is awesome? (Here's a unanimous 'Yes!' in his head.) Good.

So, according to that definition, I don't see where I'm wrong, care to enlighten me?

And I appreciate the thought of mediation, but the minute you brought up a dictionary entry, you're provoking an argument on semantics.

On a side note, I don't think the music you listen o is bad, I haven't even listened to it at all. What pisses me off is how you can so unconcernedly say that mainstream is noise while your music is what's ctually music.

......I'm half tempted to log onto Hex's account to respond to you because I really, really don't want join into this at 6:30 a.m.

YoakeNoHikari wrote:So, according to that definition, I don't see where I'm wrong, care to enlighten me?

And I appreciate the thought of mediation, but the minute you brought up a dictionary entry, you're provoking an argument on semantics.

No, no I don't, I haven't read this entire thing, nor do I care to, I'm not attempting to mediate, I'm attempting to stab the beast in the heart before it becomes alive and well. As I said previously, neither of you will agree except for possibly the definition, and even that would put an end to this. Even if one thinks something is shit, it can still absolutely be called music.

I understand that I brought up the argument of semantics, however, no party can disagree that at the base level, what they listen to is just a bunch of overlapping sounds. Which is what we call music. (I honestly can't think anyone can disagree with that.) Which just brings us to the point of everything being to one's preferences. This fight is simply over opinions, and nobody will be right or wrong. Hence my "Both of you are right and both of you are wrong" statement. (Probably should've put 'Neither of you....', but whatever.)

To explain something, Hex has a brother who listens to mainstream emo music, and he prefers older metal and some newer bands, he's always referred to it as noise. I don't agree with this, as I listen to both, but, everyone is entitled to what they believe, and he chooses to believe and defend such. His hatred for 'mainstream' has been growing for quite some time.

nobody will be right or wrong.

If I agreed with this statement, I wouldn't have started arguing.

I know.

But....what is this argument actually about? One's tastes in music? Seems like quite the pointless argument if you ask me.

I agree, Hex jumped the gun, I even forewarned him that you were going to destroy him. But, hey, we all learn who to try to argue with.

I can't particularly pick sides here, because I have to support Hex and keep my own opinion at the same time, this is why I'm trying to make everyone zoom out far enough we all see the same picture.

Though, at this point, we're just poking (didn't use the F-word, actually using 'poking') at who we are, which is pointless.

Agree to disagree, because, again, neither of you will agree on this, as no 2 people should.

Like how this is probably 'noise' to Hex, but I still love it:

I was merely saying that it's pretentious of him to call music other people like noise when I can easily say the same thing about his music.

Guys, please, can we stop this? I tried to stop this before it began. Apparently, people just ignored my message as usual.

Anyways, here is a song that I am trying to learn on guitar. It is not too hard, except for the rhythm being a little goofy in parts.

ainsoph9 wrote:Guys, please, can we stop this? I tried to stop this before it began. Apparently, people just ignored my message as usual.

Anyways, here is a song that I am trying to learn on guitar. It is not too hard, except for the rhythm being a little goofy in parts.

Spoiler! :

It's funny, because you were probably completely* right.

Why do I not like that asterisk...?

It's just a spelling correction, I misspelled it earlier. Or rather, left it in its adjectival form.

But that's off topic, so:

Ha, All that remains has some fun stuff. A song I'm really tempted to figure out on the piano:

While the voice sounds a bit "Diva-ish" (If that makes sense) I think its pretty dang cool.
Lastly, I am indeed very sorry Hikari. I know I sounded very pretentious and hipster-esque (Trust me, that was not the purpose). If you ever wish to have a discussion about the topic equally (So neither side becomes "heated") I am open...lol I do love a good cross ex every once in a while. Also, I do fully agree that you can consider my music trash, and if you think it is, I would hope you do call it that. Like I think? I said, we are entitled to our own opinions and I find it foolish to change it just because someone wants you to.

How have I never heard of Yurica/Hanatan is beyond me