I'm a little confused~ :?

shichinanatsu · Post by **shichinanatsu** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 5:17 am

sumthn came to me just now.. and i think iz coz of MusashiKen saying that first year girl could be a slider..

maybe tanigawa-san has alternate endings in mind? not sure coz i haven't read 'surprise' yet, but i somehow feel that you just can't resolve the two timelines and make it seem 'right' somehow..

the first time such a split occurred was all thanks to Yuki, but Kyon had the power to choose which universe to accept. this time however, none of the major characters are aware that a 'rift' is in place..

somehow i also feel haruhi's responsible for the AUs (BT's v09 isn't done yet so i'm grasping at straws).. if that's the case, resolution can only occur if Haruhi finds out that she's responsible - and that she's God, eventually.. in that event, she might just conjure a third universe, with an ending far from plausible..

shichinanatsu · Post by **shichinanatsu** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 5:34 am

another thought..

tanigawa-san may have quite a number of surprises up his sleeves, but i don't think kyon's being a slider is one of them, as Fh14ism said..

Kyon is the only one in the SOS Dan who's actively resisting Haruhi's will.. from that it would seem that he's 'immune' to Haruhi's power, as compared to the other three's coming to being as alien, time traveler, and esper.. i dunno if this makes a difference, but she wished for said entities to exist, whereas she needed him to exist..

tough assumptions, but hey, i haven't been prevented from making them..

MusashiKen · Post by **MusashiKen** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 3:37 pm

Well I'm pretty sure it's not that hard to resolve parallel world issues. Although I can't remember much of the original "Sliders" TV series I watched a gazillion years ago...

Another recent parallel world anime that comes to mind is Noein. But it doesn't exactly resolve the parallel world issue.

Anyway, my bet is that if there is a slider and there are parallel worlds, I think it all boils down to 2 alternatives, Haruhi or Sasaki.

Oh yeah, another very solid reason to suspect the first year girl.

Spoiler! :

magus · Post by **magus** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 8:51 pm

Well......

Spoiler! :

shichinanatsu · Post by **shichinanatsu** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 11:23 pm

that certainly puts a burden on Kyon's shoulders.. but shouldn't Asahina-san (big) be resorting to having Kyon make the decision 'beneficial' to the time travelers??

the time travelers believe that everything is predetermined, to the point that they find themselves burdened with the responsibility of intervening once in a while - albeit, the people of the 'present' oblivious - to ensure that the 'future' (aka their 'present') is at it should be..

Spoiler! :

magus · Post by **magus** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 3:55 pm

Time travelers didn't say that everything is predetermined, they just need to make sure that the predetermined things happens. Both of the Mikuru also said that it's impossible for the time travelers to change the past directly..... but Kyon is playing too big a rule in this whole thing.......

quigonkenny · Post by **quigonkenny** » Thu Jul 26, 2007 11:31 pm

Yare, yare... This is a lot of talk for a volume that, with its "un-ending" and apparent lack of anything happening, seems to just be a big advertisement for the next volume. And in a lot of ways that is true. But if you look at Volume 9 as the first part of a larger volume, it makes a lot more sense. It just makes you wonder why they just didn't make one big volume...

Anyway, my thoughts on most of the topics covered above (and more), which should not be read by anyone who hasn't read the entirety of the translated works:

Spoiler! :

First, the first-year girl Kyon takes note of in chapter 3 (α-6), and first encounters in chapter 2 (α-1), is pretty obviously a slider, and in fact I will from here on refer to her as "slider girl" for ease of reference (I really wanted to call her "Densetsu Shoujo α" but not enough people will get the reference). As to why it is obvious, in addition to her slider-like mystical appearance abilities (which aren't that mystical when you realize she could have just walked in while Kyon and Koizumi were getting chairs), I point to the more concrete reason that she doesn't appear to exist in the β side of the story at all, and to Kyon's mention in the prologue that only a slider remains missing from Haruhi's ideal collection as noted in her fateful introduction.

Slider girl is also the the apparent cause of the split between the two realities. Her calling as Kyon is in the bath seems to have only been to block Sasaki's simultaneous call (in β-1), which lead to a large number of differences between the two timelines, the largest of which are Kyon's meeting with the "evil" SOS-Dan (β-4) and the "recruitment" of the first-years (α-6). Her effect (if any) on Yuki's illness at the end of the β timeline is unclear at this time.

What is also odd is her apparent familiarity with Kyon. While someone he does not know knowing of him is certainly not unheard of (Koizumi, Mikuru, Tachibana, and Fujiwara all implied they were familiar with him within a few pages of their introductions, Haruhi knew him as John Smith, and both of the humanoid interfaces certainly knew him), she is surprised that he does not know her. I think this implies that in the timeline she slid from (let's call it "γ") they were quite familiar with each other, possibly as fellow members of the γ-timeline SOS-Dan (which might imply a time difference or a discrepency in her age), or as acquaintances outside of Haruhi(γ)-related activities. We'll certainly get this resolved (or at least somewhat clarified) in Volume 10, I'd hope.

Where Haruhi's imvolvement comes in, as it most certainly has to, being she was also the genesis for the espers, time travelers, and aliens, is that she's bored, and feels she's missing something. On the surface, she is wishing for more "fresh meat" to spice up the SOS-Dan, and sees recruitment of first-years as an obvious way to get that done, but at the lowest level of her subconscious, the level that knows about and controls her powers, she knows she's still missing a slider, so she calls one in. It's possible that the larger apparent involvement of the "evil" SOS-Dan in the slider-free β timeline somehow interfered with her ability to call slider girl, and may very well be related to Yuki's illness.

Which brings me to said Yuki(β) illness. Any thoughts on it would be appreciated, because outside of the obvious "slider-induced problems in the timeline" and "inteference from Kuyoh," I'm strapped for possible causes. What I think is pretty obvious is that she'll pull through (at least one of her will), as this popular novel series, unlike some others, is not the kind to whack major characters, and has to this point only killed one minor character (and considering her later, albeit temporary, reappearance and the inherent nebulosity in the idea of death for a humanoid interface, even that's questionable). Again, this will almost certainly be answered by Volume 10, but why wait to speculate?

Finally, regarding the time traveler involvement, during Mikuru's conversation with Kyon at the end of chapter 3 (β-6) we get a fairly entertaining one-sided conversation between Mikuru and the voice in her ear regarding the laxation of classified data, but we also get an interesting little nugget of information. We hear Mikuru (small) mention that the TPDD stands for "Time Plane Destruction Device," which we already knew from Miruku (big), but we almost get to hear Mikuru describe what it does and why it's called what it is, and it sounds like she was about to say that the crossing of time planes using the device causes some sort of destruction. This would follow with one of the more popular time travel tropes that changing the past affects the future by destroying certain possibilities, but at the same time, it goes against Mikuru's assertion in Volume 1 that her presence has no effect on the timeline.

What might be interesting is if this ties into the slider issue in that the γ timeline was destroyed by use of the TPDD, or is a timeline devoid of time travelers (or maybe both?).

So, thoughts?

Fushichou · Post by **Fushichou** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 12:29 am

Spoiler! :

magus · Post by **magus** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 1:53 am

About TPDD

Spoiler! :

About the girl

Spoiler! :

obaka-san · Post by **obaka-san** » Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:21 pm

sounds like 2 routes to get 2 different girls in eroge to me

HAL9000 · Post by **HAL9000** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 2:19 pm

quigonkenny wrote:
Spoiler! :
Which brings me to said Yuki(β) illness. Any thoughts on it would be appreciated, because outside of the obvious "slider-induced problems in the timeline" and "inteference from Kuyoh," I'm strapped for possible causes. What I think is pretty obvious is that she'll pull through (at least one of her will), as this popular novel series, unlike some others, is not the kind to whack major characters, and has to this point only killed one minor character (and considering her later, albeit temporary, reappearance and the inherent nebulosity in the idea of death for a humanoid interface, even that's questionable). Again, this will almost certainly be answered by Volume 10, but why wait to speculate?

Spoiler! :

dizzcity · Post by **dizzcity** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 4:34 pm

Does anyone else think that the slider girl may be an alternate version of Miyokichi, except older (as in, one year younger than Kyon instead of on par with his little sister)? Then the conversation in the Prologue between Kyon and Koizumi about Miyokichi might be a good form of foreshadowing, since Kyon's subconscious desire for a cute little sister like Miyoko might be expressed instead as a cute little kouhai which is fairly close to a little sister. That's if you subscribe to the Kyon-as-God theory, of course.

-Dizzy-

magus · Post by **magus** » Sun Jul 29, 2007 6:30 pm

Who knows? I just hope all this speculation won't ruin Vol.10 when it's released >_>......

HAL9000 · Post by **HAL9000** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:05 pm

dizzcity wrote:Does anyone else think that the slider girl may be an alternate version of Miyokichi, except older (as in, one year younger than Kyon instead of on par with his little sister)? Then the conversation in the Prologue between Kyon and Koizumi about Miyokichi might be a good form of foreshadowing, since Kyon's subconscious desire for a cute little sister like Miyoko might be expressed instead as a cute little kouhai which is fairly close to a little sister. That's if you subscribe to the Kyon-as-God theory, of course.

-Dizzy-

Seems unlikely to me. The resemblance probably would have hit him when he began wondering if the girl had a sibling he had met.

Spoiler! :

magus · Post by **magus** » Mon Jul 30, 2007 2:18 pm

HAL9000 wrote:
Spoiler! :
Hey... maybe it's a older/future version of Little Sister... it would be more counter-intuitive for Kyon if it was his own family.

Lol at that thought

Spoiler! :