Alternative for Images

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Krikit
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Alternative for Images

Post by Krikit »

Okay, so I've come up with an alternative for us that want the images in an easily referential section. According to:

http://www.baka-tsuki.net/project/index ... _guideline

It is okay to add whatever type of information may be relevant to the Novel. "At the very least, overview pages should contain, preferably in this order: "

The Bold section shows the important part here. This gives a project free license to add to its pages with relevant information. However, according to the gray areas which we are voting on in making the images all linked together in the Chapter Subsection, this has no possible form of complaint, as it follows the rules by adding in the information to the relevant area on the Project Overview Page.

Now, for those of us working on the eBook, or PDF, or someone who wants the images together to download, or someone that wants a directory where they can get the file extension for the image to upload inline or the Color Gallery (when we get to the later Volumes) they won't have to search through the list of uploaded files to find the images. They need only go to that page. Also, as the page itself is on MY Personal page, I have the freedom to upload and/or use on my page what I want to use/upload. (within the legal conditions of B-T anyway.)

So, we now have a Project Overview Section for the Illustrations and Inserts. No more Problem. If we still want the images where the "Color Illustrations" link is on each Novel section, we can continue to vote in a little over a week. Either way, this in no way goes against the rules laid out on the Format/Guidelines Page for having relevant information (in this case imagery) to be put on the Project Page.

EDIT: http://www.baka-tsuki.net/project/index ... e_%26_Wolf

I meant that it's already up. This isn't a poll or something that needs to be voted on. According to the guidelines, updating the Project Page with relevant, useful information, is something we can do, even if we can't modify parts that directly influence the reading of the Novel's "Set-Up".
Last edited by Krikit on Fri Sep 12, 2008 11:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Darknemo2000
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by Darknemo2000 »

Don't bother. "No" will win even if yes have more votes. It is simply pointless to vote as voting is just a useless masquerade, that means nothing as long as anyone above do not like it. Voting means nothing in these forums.
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by barbsicle »

You know, when I think about it back to a few months ago, I did kind of mention it was pointless in the first place.

Looks like I was right. Or at least, half-right.
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by Krikit »

lol, you were right ^_^. Although it took me some work to find the files and get the pages all laid out, etc. It may not be in the "color Images" section, where people can get it easily, but at least it's somewhere. And following the couple of links from the Project Overview Page, you barb can access the files all in one place now to download for say the eBook or the PDF ^_^. Of course, after your exams.

But yeah...this whole argument can still go on if it wants, as I'd like them all to be in the "Color Illustrations" folder, because it saves some browsing time, but that's really about it...This way the novel sections stick to a real light novel format, while we aren't deprived of a place where all the images are uploaded. ^_^.

Now if someone wants to gather the covers, inserts, and inlines for Volume 4+, and upload them for me, that would be wonderful. I checked ALL the uploaded files on the Wiki, and Volume 3 is the last volume there are images for (except Salv taking care of Volume 7 Ch. 3), and Judg has already started on Volume 4!!!! Where are those covers and inserts? :mrgreen:

I have Volume 4,5,8 images, but I don't have the two-page inserts in one two-page image, they are two separate images. So if someone out there wants to help at least on the inserts, I can upload the inlines for Volumes 4,5, and 8.

If we still want to have a Poll to put the images in the "Color Illustrations" section...then okay, but personally now that I have this place all set-up, it's easy to get to, and has the images all together, I'm happy. It could be better, but it's fine the way it is. :mrgreen:
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Darknemo2000
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by Darknemo2000 »

I have all of the images up to volume 8, but I won't upload them unless we have a color illustration page set up for all illustrations. Besides I don't want to degrade back to contributing members and loose right to vote.

Well, Smidge should have those anyway.
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by onizuka-gto »

As a wiki-communist party comrade representative, I have a moral obligation to make sure that voice of the people can be heard freely and in an orderly manner, i.e:

Where people take advantage where there is no guidelines, we must ensure stability and fairness.
Where there is error, we must be prepared to admit our faults.
And when we make a decisions, we must be confident to stand and uphold it.

hence there are times when i must deal harshly, sometimes when the people themselves might feel that they are being persecuted.


where in other places, such as our democratic dictatorship republican neighbours, *cough*Suki-Anime*cough* or groups who are lead by a corrupt and elitist number of privilege few, that at the slightest hint of discontent, they would close down immediately with an iron fist. crushing the common man without a cry of protest and shipping dissidents off to labour camps.

So just be glad, that this place run true to the founders principles and understand all the people must be heard so that we can work together for the motherland.
This is why we are sadden to see that where before, leniency was common placed due to the small population of the state, and things were much more simple.

But lately a number of members here, has been forcing the hand of the government to pay more attention on the codification of its policies, and to take it more serious.
I guess this is the price we pay, legal complexity for the better evolution of the state.

So after carefully evaluating the claims, I see no objection to it and see no problem with this rational.
However, I will warn you that, if a member has a valid objection to this, they have the right to bring this to a People's court of law (POLL). so play nice.
So, until them, good luck with this. And nice going with the legal loophole (Which are many, i suspect.) guess it beats waiting for another poll. smart that.

:roll: :D
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by Krikit »

Yeah, I guess I was taking too much liberty in addressing this matter. I just want to apologize for sounding rude and sort of aggressive in trying to bring this up...I understand that if someone has an objection, it can be polled. (but it will take a month for that result to come out, and in the meanwhile the Project Page can stand the way it is, as the Illustration Folder has stayed the way it is ..........argh I'm getting into this again...)

Really, I've just been watching too many McCain vs Obama videos and been saturated with politics. I'm sorry. But I am glad that at least this is legal on B-T, and can act as a way for us to reference the images while we wait for a decision about the Illustrations folder on each Volume's subsection.
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by Darknemo2000 »

You forgot to add one more thing Oni - :Where there is error, we must be prepared to admit our faults, but never correct it."

This not a communist state Oni, communist would mean that you have a equal community, which you don't, nor you have a republic based on dictatorship. What you have in here is oligarchy. And messy one at that.
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by ShadowZeroHeart »

Dark, i know it is hard, but calm down a little... oni has realized the miscalculation in his countings... so now you guys have to calm down and work out some form of solution... Fighting against each other and causing everything to break apart will not solve anything...
onizuka-gto wrote: Shadheart:
Thank you for your comments, to be truthful, I did not realise until now, that my decision render those 13 votes (including my vote)
to be effectively none.

To be honest I'm not sure why I did not see that, but fact is fact. I've violated one of my own commitments.
I'm sincerely sorry. which the best i can do in this circumstance.
Postby onizuka-gto on Sat Sep 13, 2008 9:01 pm

from the thread

http://baka-tsuki.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2315

so please try to calm down and talk to come up with a way to solve problems...
God!!
You need not forgive me.
For those I love,
The violence brought about by sinful men
Shall now be used once more.
If you were created to save this world,
If there is a single shred of hope left for the future of mankind,
I am very sorry, but, please begone!
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by Krikit »

Spoiler! :
onizuka-gto wrote:As a wiki-communist party comrade representative, I have a moral obligation to make sure that voice of the people can be heard freely and in an orderly manner, i.e:

Where people take advantage where there is no guidelines, we must ensure stability and fairness.
Where there is error, we must be prepared to admit our faults.
And when we make a decisions, we must be confident to stand and uphold it.

hence there are times when i must deal harshly, sometimes when the people themselves might feel that they are being persecuted.


where in other places, such as our democratic dictatorship republican neighbours, *cough*Suki-Anime*cough* or groups who are lead by a corrupt and elitist number of privilege few, that at the slightest hint of discontent, they would close down immediately with an iron fist. crushing the common man without a cry of protest and shipping dissidents off to labour camps.

So just be glad, that this place run true to the founders principles and understand all the people must be heard so that we can work together for the motherland.
This is why we are sadden to see that where before, leniency was common placed due to the small population of the state, and things were much more simple.

But lately a number of members here, has been forcing the hand of the government to pay more attention on the codification of its policies, and to take it more serious.
I guess this is the price we pay, legal complexity for the better evolution of the state.

So after carefully evaluating the claims, I see no objection to it and see no problem with this rational.
However, I will warn you that, if a member has a valid objection to this, they have the right to bring this to a People's court of law (POLL). so play nice.
So, until them, good luck with this. And nice going with the legal loophole (Which are many, i suspect.) guess it beats waiting for another poll. smart that.

:roll: :D
Okay, so we're trying to force the hand of the government to care more about it's policies. It really comes down to the original fight between Smidge and Dark about Dark wanting to put the images all together, and Smidge saying no. Heck, there isn't even a section in the "Color Illustrations" part of the Guidlines Page that says you CAN'T put the inserts in the illustration page. They just say what should be included (illustrations and inserts) but not that inlines should be excluded. Inlines HAVE to be in text according to the guidelines, but it doesn't limit them here. In the end, the default of this should have been Dark being able to put all the images together, while the Poll was made to decide to take them away. It was the opposite. The Spice and Wolf image pages were locked, and the inlines couldn't be put in, even though nothing in the rules stipulated they couldn't be put in.

Then, after a new Poll was made, there was difficulty in transferring the votes. Oni, you already admitted to making the mistake, and finally realizing that hey...those votes really didn't count..whoops. Which is what us arguing understood from the beginning, and tried to get you to understand recently ^_^. But anyway, in the end, you decided to uphold the answer given that even though it was a miscalculation, the earlier response about #4 winning would rule.

But we're not raising our hand against the government to force it to take action. We just wanted the Poll to be fair, and there were problems in communication. No biggie. We aren't out to try and get the wiki to follow certain parts of it's guidelines.

If option #4 had won fair and square, we wouldn't have complained. That would have been that. And then 2 weeks later, without arguing, the Poll would have come out again if people still cared enough. This isn't a problem, and we would have and will follow the guidelines. It's just that for this Poll, the result was unfair, in that counting itself messed up the Honest Polling. That's what we got mad about. Not the results themselves. If it was just the results, again, we would have waited patiently, and tried again. It's the fact that it was unfair that we blew up.

But it's over now, and with all the arguments settled, we can only wait now for the time the new poll can be created, and try again.
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by ShadowZeroHeart »

Actually, I have been thinking... but these kind of polls should only be limited to editors right...? maybe at most include translators too?

I mean, we can come up with a heavenly plan, but it still boils down to the editors to do the work for us =X
So shouldnt they be the ones to decide what they should/wanna do?

Even if all the readers out there decide to go with plan #5, and no editors like plan #5 at all to implement it or lack the skills to do so... it will not be done that way nonetheless? ^^"

We should be creating a good working environment for the workers =X not the customers... we are not exactly obliged to deliver anything to the readers, its a free web, and a fan-translation... If we scare away all the workers, there is nothing to deliver to the customers after all... so basically workers should get more rights than customers in this case =X if the customers dont like it ^^ they can come in and join our fun ^^ dont you think?
God!!
You need not forgive me.
For those I love,
The violence brought about by sinful men
Shall now be used once more.
If you were created to save this world,
If there is a single shred of hope left for the future of mankind,
I am very sorry, but, please begone!
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by Krikit »

HAHAHA WOW...Shadow that was really insightful.

Like, Really insightful, and you just blew everything I was thinking out of the water. Of course, no matter what the readers poll, if no one wants to take the time, or knows how, to implement it, then it doesn't mean anything anyway.

So your suggesting that only Active editors, and possibly translators too, have the right to vote in a poll that changes the format of the pages?
While it has an interesting theme, I don't think it's practical....

For one, no-name people can still learn how to edit a wiki and do it themselves if they want it, and it's allowed. Heck, that's how I've been learning about wiki stuff from starting off here as a lurker. People will implement it if they want it enough.

But still, it's very interesting to look at the ones that will have to implement it. (though from this, I'm sure Dark is more than willing to implement it once/if it gets approved).

hmmm....
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by ShadowZeroHeart »

Krikit wrote:HAHAHA WOW...Shadow that was really insightful.

Like, Really insightful, and you just blew everything I was thinking out of the water. Of course, no matter what the readers poll, if no one wants to take the time, or knows how, to implement it, then it doesn't mean anything anyway.

So your suggesting that only Active editors, and possibly translators too, have the right to vote in a poll that changes the format of the pages?
While it has an interesting theme, I don't think it's practical....

For one, no-name people can still learn how to edit a wiki and do it themselves if they want it, and it's allowed. Heck, that's how I've been learning about wiki stuff from starting off here as a lurker. People will implement it if they want it enough.

But still, it's very interesting to look at the ones that will have to implement it. (though from this, I'm sure Dark is more than willing to implement it once/if it gets approved).

hmmm....
LOLz, i am in no way insightful, just speaking my mind off, and looking at what results will pop up =X

Yes, no-name people can of course, edit a wiki and do it themselves... But personally if you ask me ~.~ if they destroy our own format like that, they are not really editors but more of pranksters... I mean, its like taking your homework, doodle on it and running off because they think it looks nicer that way. =X
If they really want it that much, why not just join us and give their comments/suggestions?

If that is your reason why it is not practical, I can just tell you that Dark can always implement the way he wants anytime he wants ^^ since no-name people can edit when and as they feel like it ^^ Thus removing the need for even a poll haha!

Just that readers will have to pick a lucky time to read to see what format is up at that period of time hahaha!

Btw! i have seen websites that allow you to choose the template which you see the webby in, can we do something similar for the illustrations? just a question =X coz if that is possible, then different formats can be implemented, saving our big discussions over the polls =X
God!!
You need not forgive me.
For those I love,
The violence brought about by sinful men
Shall now be used once more.
If you were created to save this world,
If there is a single shred of hope left for the future of mankind,
I am very sorry, but, please begone!
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Re: Alternative for Images

Post by onizuka-gto »

Krikit wrote: It really comes down to the original fight between Smidge and Dark about Dark wanting to put the images all together, and Smidge saying no.
I think people forget, that Admin are Members first, Moderators second.

Just because Smidge was representing the state does not mean he did not have the right to express his opinion.

If Darknemo suggestions were accepted unanimously, then we would not of been in this situation, but that was not the case.

When that happen the thread was created for the affected parties to debate and attempt to discuss a compromise.

However both sides were adamant and stubborn, thus it went to a poll.

However things got more complicated as the debate grew more heated, hence i had to step in to ensure that it was conducted in a fair manner.

Since this is not the thread t odiscuss the more technical aspects of the poll, i will discuss this matter in this one:
http://www.baka-tsuki.net/forums/viewto ... f=4&t=2315
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