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larethian
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Generic Translated Content, Feedback Appreciated

Post by larethian »

For first timers who are not too confident of their translations and want some checking before working on the wiki or for people to do tests for potential translators.

Please post material in spoiler tags, and indicate title, volume, page.

From Teh_ping: Note that any comments that are not beneficial to these prospects will be automatically deleted without warning, thank you. Constructive criticism is much appreciated. (Not directed at Lare here, in case anyone's asking)
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by Hazue »

mahouka koukou no rettousei, vol 1, part 2, page 58 & 59
Spoiler! :
the 2nd day of high school life, it was the same as always.
it is not like after he had attended high school, the earth's rotation cycle will be affected.
he lightly washed his face first...... then properly wash his face again for the second time, and wears the usual attire.
going down stairs to the dining room, it can be seen that Miyuki has already started to prepare the breakfast.
"morning, Miyuki. you are quite early"
the sky was not bright, it isn't even the time for the spring's sun to rise high enough to take a peek on our face.
to go to school, such time is definitely too early.
the school starts at 8am sharp, traveling to school takes roughly 30 minutes therefore leaving the house at 7.30am will be ideal.
but even including time needed to prepare the breakfast, eat it, and clean the dishes..... there are still more than an hour of spare time left
"good morning, oni-sama..... please"
"thanks"
she handed over a glass filled with fresh juice.
after expressing an honest gratitude, he drank all the juice in just one breath, then return the glass back to her.
Tatsuya's breathing method, is well practiced because of Miyuki.
when he is about to say "i'm leaving" while facing his sister that is going back to the kitchen table, his sister turned her body around.
"oni-sama, i was actually planning to go with you....."
just when she stop talking, she lift a basket full of sandwich and show him.
it seems like the breakfast, instead of 'started to prepare', it is more like 'finished preparing'
"alright..... but, are you coming while wearing uniform?"
noticing the difference of the trainer he is wearing, and her school uniform that can be seen under the apron, he asked.
"i hadn't report to teacher about the school entry yet....
and also i can no longer accompany you in training"
and that is Miyuki's answer to the question.
wearing the school uniform in the early morning, is because she wanted to show him her high school look.
"understood. though it is not necessary for you to have the same morning training as mine, but Master will definitely be happy to see you.
....... perhaps too happy, that i hope he won't be let loose"
"if that happens, then oni-sama please protect me."
looking at his sister's cute one-eye-closed face, a smile surfaced on Tatsuya naturally.

*****the 'Master' has no specific gender so i simply use 'he' when i think third-person-singular is more approriate in the sentence
i took 1 hour in quick translating 2 pages(which the translated sentences often don't make sense in english), took more than 2 hour to rearrange the sentence in order to make sure it could makes sense in english.
"たがが外れ" took me the longest time, but in the end i couldn't find a more appropriate word.
sensei, please rate. and help me correct it so i could know my mistake and learn from it.

sankyu.
Currently addicted to Acchi Kocchi's manga translation. Sorry BT, for not translating the novel I had registered :(
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by Teh_ping »

Hazue wrote:mahouka koukou no rettousei, vol 1, part 2, page 58 & 59
Spoiler! :
It was the 2nd day of high school life, it was the same as always.
it is not like the earth's rotation cycle will be affected after he attended high school.
he washed his face lightly first...... and properly washed his face again for the second time, and wore the usual attire.
He went down the stairs to the dining room, and saw that Miyuki has already started to prepare the breakfast.
"M[/colororning, Miyuki. you are quite early."
The sky was not bright; it wasn't even the time for the spring's sun to rise high enough to take a peek on their faces.
Such a time is definitely too early to go to school.
School starts at 8am sharp; traveling to school takes roughly 30 minutes, therefore, it would be ideal to leave the house at 7.30am.
But even after including time needed to prepare the breakfast, eat, and wash the dishes..... there are still more than an hour of spare time left.
"Good morning, onii-sama..... please"
"Thanks"
She handed over a glass filled with fresh juice.
After expressing an honest gratitude, he drank all the juice in just one breath, then return the glass back to her.
Tatsuya's breathing method was well practiced because of Miyuki.
When he is about to say "i'm leaving" while facing his sister that is going back to the kitchen table, his sister turned her body around.
"Onii-sama, i was actually planning to go with you....."
just when she stop talking, she lift a basket full of sandwich and showed him.
It seemed like the breakfast was 'prepared' instead of 'getting prepared'.
"Alright..... but, are you coming while wearing your uniform?"
Noticing the difference of the trainer he is wearing, and her school uniform that can be seen under the apron, he asked. (Note: I'm assuming that the former statement was said by Tatsuya first)
"i hadn't reported to teacher about the school entry yet....
And also I can no longer accompany you in training"
and that is Miyuki's answer to the question.
wearing the school uniform in the early morning, is because she wanted to show him her high school look.
"understood. It is not necessary for you to have the same morning training as mine, but Master will definitely be happy to see you.
....... perhaps too happy, that i hope he won't be let loose" (If you put a 'though'/although in front, do not put a 'but'/'however' at the next part)
"If that happens, then onii-sama, please protect me."
Looking at his sister's cute face with an eye closed, a smile surfaced on Tatsuya naturally.

*****the 'Master' has no specific gender so i simply use 'he' when i think third-person-singular is more approriate in the sentence

i took 1 hour in quick translating 2 pages(which the translated sentences often don't make sense in english), took more than 2 hour to rearrange the sentence in order to make sure it could makes sense in english.
"たがが外れ" took me the longest time, but in the end i couldn't find a more appropriate word.
sensei, please rate. and help me correct it so i could know my mistake and learn from it.

sankyu.


Keeping it to past tense since it was inconsistent. Keep practising.

Was it first person or third person? I'll keep it to third person since I haven't read the novel.
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by YoakeNoHikari »

Not everyone has the raws on hand (not everyone being me), so could you transcribe the relevant parts?

Well, if it's two pages, I suppose you can just wait for someone who does have the raws. Sorry I couldn't help.
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by larethian »

Hazue wrote:mahouka koukou no rettousei, vol 1, part 2, page 58 & 59
Spoiler! :
the 2nd day of high school life, it was the same as always.
it is not like after he had attended high school, the earth's rotation cycle will be affected.
he lightly washed his face first...... then properly wash his face again for the second time, and wears the usual attire.
going down stairs to the dining room, it can be seen that Miyuki has already started to prepare the breakfast.
"morning, Miyuki. you are quite early"
the sky was not bright, it isn't even the time for the spring's sun to rise high enough to take a peek on our face.
to go to school, such time is definitely too early.
the school starts at 8am sharp, traveling to school takes roughly 30 minutes therefore leaving the house at 7.30am will be ideal.
but even including time needed to prepare the breakfast, eat it, and clean the dishes..... there are still more than an hour of spare time left
"good morning, oni-sama..... please"
"thanks"
she handed over a glass filled with fresh juice.
after expressing an honest gratitude, he drank all the juice in just one breath, then return the glass back to her.
Tatsuya's breathing method, is well practiced because of Miyuki.
when he is about to say "i'm leaving" while facing his sister that is going back to the kitchen table, his sister turned her body around.
"oni-sama, i was actually planning to go with you....."
just when she stop talking, she lift a basket full of sandwich and show him.
it seems like the breakfast, instead of 'started to prepare', it is more like 'finished preparing'
"alright..... but, are you coming while wearing uniform?"
noticing the difference of the trainer he is wearing, and her school uniform that can be seen under the apron, he asked.
"i hadn't report to teacher about the school entry yet....
and also i can no longer accompany you in training"
and that is Miyuki's answer to the question.
wearing the school uniform in the early morning, is because she wanted to show him her high school look.
"understood. though it is not necessary for you to have the same morning training as mine, but Master will definitely be happy to see you.
....... perhaps too happy, that i hope he won't be let loose"
"if that happens, then oni-sama please protect me."
looking at his sister's cute one-eye-closed face, a smile surfaced on Tatsuya naturally.

*****the 'Master' has no specific gender so i simply use 'he' when i think third-person-singular is more approriate in the sentence
i took 1 hour in quick translating 2 pages(which the translated sentences often don't make sense in english), took more than 2 hour to rearrange the sentence in order to make sure it could makes sense in english.
"たがが外れ" took me the longest time, but in the end i couldn't find a more appropriate word.
sensei, please rate. and help me correct it so i could know my mistake and learn from it.

sankyu.
Like Teh_Ping said, tenses and also, I'd prefer if you don't quick translate and spend time working on the English for this work, because this novel has pretty good literary style, and I'd prefer it didn't get destroyed in the translation process (I'm far from perfect in English either, but it'd nice if you can keep the quality of descriptions). I'd actually put translating this as hard as CSR/Shana (don't take my word for it since I've forgotten the sentence patterns in CSR and Shana), not because of the Japanese less terminology, but because of the relatively detailed and flowery descriptions which requires a good arsenal of English vocab and some skill in rendering long descriptions in English. Another point to note is that these 2 pages happen to fall under the easier bracket for the novel. Luckily, you didn't start with chapter 1 since I already started working on it :lol: I don't have time to fix everything, so I'll just use comments demarcated by /* */.
Spoiler! :
the 2nd day of high school life, it was the same as always. /* what happened to 目覚め? Even as he awoke to the second day as a high school student, it was the same as always. */

it is not like after he had attended high school, the earth's rotation cycle will be affected. /* good, just need some English fix */

he lightly washed his face first...... then properly wash his face again for the second time, and wears the usual attire. /* He lightly washed his face --- since he was going to properly wash it again later --- and put on his usual attire. */

going down stairs to the dining room, it can be seen that Miyuki has already started to prepare the breakfast. /* English */

"morning, Miyuki. you are quite early" /* ok */

the sky was not bright, it isn't even the time for the spring's sun to rise high enough to take a peek on our face. /* English, this is too literal */

to go to school, such time is definitely too early. /* English */

the school starts at 8am sharp, traveling to school takes roughly 30 minutes therefore leaving the house at 7.30am will be ideal. /* acceptable, editors can fix stuff like this */

but even including time needed to prepare the breakfast, eat it, and clean the dishes..... there are still more than an hour of spare time left /* good, just need some English fix */

"good morning, oni-sama..... please" /* "please" is too literal and means nothing in English in this context, you can use "please help yourself" for どうぞ here */

"thanks" /* ok */

she handed over a glass filled with fresh juice. /* ok */

after expressing an honest gratitude, he drank all the juice in just one breath, then return the glass back to her. /* nothing wrong here in comprehension except for a missing detail; this may sound better: After a sincere word of gratitude, he emptied the glass in one breath, then returned the glass back to her outstretched hand. */

Tatsuya's breathing method, is well practiced because of Miyuki. /* too literal and a little off towards the end; this is actually trying to explain the previous sentence on why Miyuki's hand was there ready to take the cup: --- Miyuki had a perfect grasp of Tatsuya's breathing pattern. */

when he is about to say "i'm leaving" while facing his sister that is going back to the kitchen table, his sister turned her body around. /* very close, otherwise not bad (btw, we don't use 'that' for people) : Just at the exact moment when he was about to say "I'm leaving" to his little sister, who was once again facing the kitchen table, Miyuki's hands stopped and she turned around. */

"oni-sama, i was actually planning to go with you....." /* where's 今朝 */

just when she stop talking, she lift a basket full of sandwich and show him. /* good, just need some English fix */

it seems like the breakfast, instead of 'started to prepare', it is more like 'finished preparing' /* again too literal, this is actually the narrator making a correction, so it's good to use back the same previous words */

"alright..... but, are you coming while wearing uniform?" /* I don't mind but...... will you be coming in your uniform? */

noticing the difference of the trainer he is wearing, and her school uniform that can be seen under the apron, he asked. /* トレーナー here means sweatshirt. otherwise the liberal translation of 見比べ can be accepted if an accurate smooth sounding English phrase cannot be thought of */

"i hadn't report to teacher about the school entry yet.... /* keep to Sensei here, because she's using it as an honorific respectful address, moreover, Sensei is not necessarily a Kyoushi. Other than that, English again */

and also i can no longer accompany you in training" /* it's good to end off with Onii-sama to take out the confusion of who is speaking and since the original text also has Onii-sama: i can no longer accompany you in your training, Onii-sama */

and that is Miyuki's answer to the question. /* tense */

wearing the school uniform in the early morning, is because she wanted to show him her high school look. /* English here makes things confusing and ambiguous */

"understood. though it is not necessary for you to have the same morning training as mine, but Master will definitely be happy to see you. /* IIRC 'though' and 'but' never appear in the same sentence, ie. no double contrast preps I think (I know I also make this mistake a lot LOL). */

....... perhaps too happy, that i hope he won't be let loose" /* I suppose you got the meaning of たがが外れる (http://detail.chiebukuro.yahoo.co.jp/qa ... 1415998234) right but the literalness is confusing to a reader, this may be better, perhaps: ......I just hope he doesn't start running amok from being overly happy. */

"if that happens, then oni-sama please protect me." /* ok */

looking at his sister's cute one-eye-closed face, a smile surfaced on Tatsuya naturally. /* over literal again, Miyuki's winking so just use 'wink' will do */

*****the 'Master' has no specific gender so i simply use 'he' when i think third-person-singular is more approriate in the sentence
Unless the author is not too good/stylish with language (like Kagami, whose works I'm translating because of the epic plot and characters, so screw the language), I normally value quality over quantity. So just take your time, you'll also get better. I normally won't recommend Mahouka to a new translator unless your English is very good, but I won't stop you from working on it if you enjoy it, it's FFA. Keep them coming, we need more Translators :D

And the master has a gender, it's good to read ahead what you're translating :D


@Teh_Ping this novel is done in third person narration.
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by jonathanasdf »

About this thread, I was actually thinking this might do better as a thread about checking/proofing translations, not about editing english... that can be left to the editor of the specific series can't it? So if you don't have the raws, then it doesn't make much sense for you to edit it.

That said, I guess I'll leave it up to larethian to decide what this thread should do... delete this post if anyone wants to.
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by larethian »

jonathanasdf wrote:About this thread, I was actually thinking this might do better as a thread about checking/proofing translations, not about editing english... that can be left to the editor of the specific series can't it? So if you don't have the raws, then it doesn't make much sense for you to edit it.

That said, I guess I'll leave it up to larethian to decide what this thread should do... delete this post if anyone wants to.
Disagree, English is an integral part of translation, there's a limit to what editors can do if they don't know what the translator is trying to translate. Hazue's translations warrant our comments on his English.
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by Doraneko »

For those who are interested, here is the original text from the web novel. The published version may be slightly different.
Spoiler! :
 目覚めは、いつもと同じだった。
 彼が高校生になったからといって、地球の自転周期が変化するはずもない。
 簡単に顔を洗い――後でもう一度、しっかりと洗顔することになるからだ――いつもの服に着替える。
 ダイニングに下りると、既に深雪が朝食の準備を始めていた。
「おはよう、深雪。今朝は一段と早いな」
 まだ空が白んだだけで、春の陽は顔を覗かせてもいない。
 学校へは、当然早すぎる時刻だ。
「おはようございます、お兄様……どうぞ」
「ありがとう」
 差し出されたコップにはフレッシュジュース。
 律儀に礼を述べてから一息に飲み干し、差し出された手にコップを返す。
 達也の呼吸は、深雪によって完全に掌握されていた。
「お兄様、今朝はわたしもご一緒させていただこうかと思っているのですが……」
 そう言い終えると同時に、サンドイッチを詰めたバスケットを抱え上げて振り返る。どうやら、朝食を「作り始めた」ではなく、「作り終えかけていた」が正解だったらしい。
「それは構わないが……制服で行くのか?」
 自分の着ているトレーナーと、エプロンの下から現れた制服を見比べながら達也が問う。
「先生にまだ、進学のご報告をしておりませんので……
 それにわたしではもう、お兄様の鍛錬について行けませんから」
 こんな早朝から制服に着替えていたのは、高校生姿を見せに行く為、という訳だ。
「分かった。別に朝練で深雪が俺と同じことをする必要はないんだが、そういうことなら師匠も喜ぶだろう。
 ……喜び過ぎで、たがが外れなきゃいいけどな」
「その時はお兄様、深雪を守ってくださいね」
 可愛らしく片目をつぶる妹を前に、達也の顔には自然と笑みが浮かんでいた。
@Hazue: if you intend to focus on this series for your practice and hope to receive more comments, it may be helpful to include also the relevant parts from the web novel. Not everyone here has a copy of the book.
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by jonathanasdf »

larethian wrote: Disagree, English is an integral part of translation, there's a limit to what editors can do if they don't know what the translator is trying to translate. Hazue's translations warrant our comments on his English.
Good point, I guess I put it the wrong way. What I really meant to say was that like... teh_ping's edits above was pretty much exactly like what an editor could do, because he said he didn't have the raws, so those probably don't suit the idea of this thread as much?

Though if what is done in the future is that the section is transcribed as well like what Doraneko has done, then it's fine.

Anyways, just 1 thing:
Spoiler! :
it is not like after he had attended high school, the earth's rotation cycle will be affected. "after he had attended high school" makes me think of it as he has graduated high school, maybe keeping it to "after he became a high school student" or "after he started attending high school" would be better
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by YoakeNoHikari »

Hazue wrote:"oni-sama, i was actually planning to go with you....."
「お兄様、今朝はわたしもご一緒させていただこうかと思っているのですが……」
Just nitpicking on the first thing I laid my eyes upon.

LIke Larethian said, when the prose is like this, it's usually a good idea to reflect it in the translation. Your translation is completely fine in meaning, but when such a line is said with this degree of politesse:

"Onii-sama, I was thinking that you would let me accompany you this morning..."

Would fit more readily along the lines of ご一緒させていただこう I think.

Once again, nitpicking. And I just picked a random line.
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by jonathanasdf »

And just some nitpicking on that nitpicking. At least from how I interpret the flow, it's more like 「お兄様、今朝はわたしもご一緒させていただこうかと思っているのですが……」 so it's more like she's thinking about a question so rather than "thinking" I think "wondering" would fit better. Something like: "Onii-sama, I was wondering whether you would allow me to accompany you this morning......"


Something short that I need help with... from Date A Live vol1 prologue
Spoiler! :
それは、少女だった。
奇妙な光のドレスを纏った少女が一人、立っていた。
「ぁ――」
嘆息に、微かな声が混じって消える。

I current have it as "The faint sigh dissolves in the air." but it doesn't seem even close to being as pretty...
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by YoakeNoHikari »

"Onii-sama, I was wondering whether you would allow me to accompany you this morning......?"
Yep, you're completely right. However, I feel like nitpicking on that some more, but if we continued to nitpick over each others' translations, it'd become a matter of opinion, so is there really a need to reduce something past its base essence?
嘆息に、微かな声が混じって消える。
The faint sigh dissolves in the air.
Allow me to nitpick.

The faint sigh doesn't dissolve in the air; the faint voice is intermingled with the sigh, which then disappears. And, in terms of pure aesthetics: "Her faint voice lingered within her sigh, and it faded into nothingness."

Is there an adjectival form of 'reality'?
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by jonathanasdf »

Yep, you're completely right. However, I feel like nitpicking on that some more, but if we continued to nitpick over each others' translations, it'd become a matter of opinion, so is there really a need to reduce something past its base essence?
Let's leave it at that then.
The faint sigh doesn't dissolve in the air; the faint voice is intermingled with the sigh, which then disappears.
Yeah, I didn't really quite understand that, because if you say that a sigh is the sound, then there is no voice other than the sigh to intermingle with it; but if a sigh is like a word, and the voice is the sound, then again you can't mix them. So saying that his sigh mixes with his voice, it just doesn't make any sense to me lol. By the way, I'm pretty sure that the sound was made by the guy who saw the girl. But of course you couldn't tell that from the snippet I posted so my bad.

But I think the final interpretation you posted about the voice lingering within the sigh, that seems great to me, since it's not like a mixing of any sort so you don't need 2 distinct sources.

Edit: I settled on "Enveloped by his faint voice, the sigh slowly faded away.", but suggestions on how to make it better is always welcome.

and... realistic?
Last edited by jonathanasdf on Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by YoakeNoHikari »

and... realistic?
Ehh...Doesn't really have the same degree of meaning as what I'm searching for.

Realistic would mean 'like reality', but it still gives off this feeling that it's fake. I'm looking for an adjective which can be appended to 'World' and definitively declare that the world is reality.

I really don't want to use World of Reality.

Also, how does js06 maintain enough concentration to do 30kb in a day regularly? Does he give up his free time, or does he just translate 30kb/hour?
If only I had that sort of dedication; I spent the entire past week playing Baldr Sky's fandisc, (and I've still yet to finish.)
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Re: Generic Thread for Translated Content

Post by jonathanasdf »

Trying to come up with the word you want without having a context is hard indeed. Anyways, wouldn't "real world" work?
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