Campione! - Names, Terminology and Stylistic Issues

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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby Kadi » Tue Sep 04, 2012 5:01 am

We had the Miko / Hime-Miko discussion on page 2 and 3 of this thread. Maybe it came up again later... yeah, I guess it did. I remember the Miko / magical Miko / Western priestess mess that remained unresolved.


And there'd be no need to add references if we put CBC and BBC in Italian because... they are names. We don't add notes saying "Bandiera is Italian for cape", either. At least I think we don't. That said, we should be VERY careful about changing CBC and BBC because the readers have gotten used to those names for ages.
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby chancs » Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:14 pm

Kadi wrote:We had the Miko / Hime-Miko discussion on page 2 and 3 of this thread. Maybe it came up again later... yeah, I guess it did. I remember the Miko / magical Miko / Western priestess mess that remained unresolved.


And there'd be no need to add references if we put CBC and BBC in Italian because... they are names. We don't add notes saying "Bandiera is Italian for cape", either. At least I think we don't. That said, we should be VERY careful about changing CBC and BBC because the readers have gotten used to those names for ages.


Correct. Changing the names after 7 volumes will be too difficult to adapt. :roll:
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby florza » Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:27 pm

I'd like for miko and hime-miko to remain as it is. Think of it as a name of a faction, if you will.

The only change I'd accept is....
Spoiler! :
Mahou Miko. Or Miko Rangers.
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby Kadi » Thu Sep 06, 2012 10:28 am

Well, let's leave the poor miko and hime-miko alone for the moment. Which does not mean they're safe forever. I'm considering shrine maiden (conventional miko), shrine princess (hime-miko), priestess (western priestesses + magical miko) and SOMETHING (Alice's white miko-hime), but I'll see how that works out first. But if it does work out, I will push for a change. The less we have to rely on Japanese/Chinese words, the better.

Interesting tidbit from V13: The miko and the witch disposition have the same origin. If they tried, miko could probably learn witchcraft, but before they become able to use grand rituals, they'd need to spend ten or twenty years learning. That's why at least the Japanese focus on the miko spirit arts and ignores the witch-possibilities. Conversely, the average witch will be able to use spirit arts (like Liliana uses spirit vision), but the average miko will be more skilled at them because they focus their skill set. I like how that turned out.


Since it's about to get important: Is everybody okay with the "最後の王" being the "King of the End" and not the "Last King"? The latter is technically correct and even a closer translation, but the former works perfectly with the longer description "この世の最後に顕れる王", "The king who appears at the end of this world/age". And there were kings after him so he's not the last anyway~~


P.S.: Made some changes to the Terminology page. "殲滅の特権 Annihilation's Privilege" is now "Extermination Privilege" which sounds better and allows us to have Exterminators later! Or maybe Exterminatress...es? "聖絶 Absolute Holiness" was a mistranslation probably of mine. Holy Severing is closer, but "Smiting" should work so much better in the actual text, so that's how I put it. If I overlooked something or if you have even better alternatives, come at me!
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby florza » Thu Sep 06, 2012 5:05 pm

Kadi wrote:Interesting tidbit from V13: The miko and the witch disposition have the same origin. If they tried, miko could probably learn witchcraft, but before they become able to use grand rituals, they'd need to spend ten or twenty years learning. That's why at least the Japanese focus on the miko spirit arts and ignores the witch-possibilities. Conversely, the average witch will be able to use spirit arts (like Liliana uses spirit vision), but the average miko will be more skilled at them because they focus their skill set. I like how that turned out.


Is actually already revealed in V4 :P It stated that when Christianity became the main religion in Europe, the miko that worshipped the earth goddesses were branded as heretical and as witches. Essentially the same roots.

Rest of the terms, no real objections.
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby zzhk » Sun Sep 09, 2012 6:33 am

chancs wrote:Won't it be "Onee-samas" rather than "Onee-sama" when Hikari addresses the other girls during the fight?

I read that "gata" is added for making it plural. "Oneesama-gata". Here

I expect honorifics to keep the same form whether singular or plural, the same way as words like miko. If readers can deal with Hime-Miko being used as both singular and plural, they should be able to handle -sama.

But anyway, let's see what other people think... Thoughts, anyone?
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby florza » Sun Sep 09, 2012 7:47 am

It is true that Hikari does use 'gata'. It is also true that it's lesser known compared to other terms.

As it is, the plural meaning can be easily conveyed with the rest of the sentence.

If we translated 'gata', then we might as well translate all the 'tachi' (Sorry, I'm not going to go back and look for where all of those are).
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby Kadi » Sun Sep 09, 2012 8:02 am

If you added the -gata/tachi, I'd start swinging hammer anyway. The only question is plural-s or no s... I admit no-s-but-plural feels weirder with san/sama than with miko, but... it's a price we can pay, I think. As florza said, the context will make it clear enough. I know some people will not get it, but then again, judging from their question, there are some readers who I doubt have even read the text. Paradoxical, isn't it?
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby zzhk » Sun Sep 09, 2012 6:03 pm

My sentiments exactly, glad we have a consensus.

Honorifics unchanged for plurals it is (which is what I suspect everyone has been doing all along anyway).

*Edit:
Question for Kadi just in case you miss it in the wiki, since this concerns one of those chapters done by our esteemed mysterious contributor...
Drowzycow wrote:Ena likes to use repetition in her speech eg. "I see I see.". Just so we are being consistent, should I be throwing a comma in between?, so it becomes "I see, I see" In some edits I have been doing that but I'm beginning to think the lack of commas is intentional --Drowzycow (talk) 18:02, 9 September 2012 (CDT)
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby Kadi » Mon Sep 10, 2012 2:56 am

Thanks for pointing that out. I said it on the Wiki as well, but: I don't think it matters that much. I imagine the Japanese phrasing to be quite fast/short, so adding a comma in the English will draw it out, making it seem longer. It's a change in the impression the character gives.

It could be replaced with something else entirely that keeps the impression, but that would require creativity and I'm lazy right now.
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby chancs » Thu Sep 13, 2012 3:14 am

Kadi wrote:If you added the -gata/tachi, I'd start swinging hammer anyway. The only question is plural-s or no s... I admit no-s-but-plural feels weirder with san/sama than with miko, but... it's a price we can pay, I think. As florza said, the context will make it clear enough. I know some people will not get it, but then again, judging from their question, there are some readers who I doubt have even read the text. Paradoxical, isn't it?


So, in the texts also such convenience is followed?
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby zzhk » Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:28 am

Can someone help translate two lines from Volume 8 Chapter 4 Part 4 on page 200?

The Chinese version seems to have skipped two sentences of narration between Lucretia seeking permission to ask a question and Alec's response. It occurs immediately after the scene transition when they enter her house.

Sorry, I don't have it in txt-format to paste.

Thanks in advance!
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby Kadi » Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:52 am

"Before we're talking about Hero Lancelot, can I ask you something?" Lucretia said when they reached the living room.
Everyone around the table with three cups of herb tea.<!--portions for three people~~-->
reply make you answer my questions blablabla
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby zzhk » Mon Sep 17, 2012 2:34 pm

Perfect, thanks!
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Re: Campione! - Terminology, Editing and Translation Issues

Postby Rednal » Mon Sep 17, 2012 7:19 pm

On the minor confusion about V8 C2 having "COMPLETE" at the end of its name when it obviously isn't: Problem solved. If people still don't get it when there's a percent tag saying nothing's been done, then I don't think anything will, so yeah. XD On the bright side, it'll stop being an issue once it's done being translated?
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