Re: So, Incest ending impossibru?
Posted: Mon Nov 18, 2013 8:35 pm
You got the wrong volume. Was in v11. Anyway
Spoiler! :
Thanks, fixed that; also.Gohankuten wrote:You got the wrong volume. Was in v11. AnywaySpoiler! :
Niflheim wrote:That wasn't very much really. Since his entire theory hinged on one claim that he could not substantiate it didnt really need much. Had I gone all out you would have been greeted by a massive wall of text full of quotes
Just look at the part of where he named magic Miyuki uses. Inferno is a no brainer of what it is mythology wise. Niflheim however isnt where the dead go in norse mythology, not until later after the creation. In norse mythology the way you died and the choice of Odin decided where you went in the afterlife. So while on one level he is sort of right he is at the same time wrong for making such a simple destinction that once dead you end up in Niflheim. Cocytus isn't either the final destination in greek mythology, it is just 1 of the 5 rivers around hades with Styx being the famous one. This gets even more complicated when you consider the name Miya earned which is one of the other rivers as well, Mistress of Lethe.
I don't doubt that on some level Tatsuya is modeled after Shiva, the name given to him by the great asian alliance is Mahesvara and if i recall correct that is what Shiva is called in some buddhist work. But I won't do some great logical leap to imply all aspects of the deity Shiva will be incoperated into the character Tatsuya and that is simply because the entier mythology around Shiva is so complex even within hinduism.
His second post is even more depended on that his initial theory is correct. It also mixes up and embellishing around Parvati and Sati.
Going to climb down the walls now.
To be honest the more of these theories I work my way through the more I start to believe that the hinting of more than a sibling relationship is just a cheap ploy and bait, bloody brilliant one too, to instigate these types of theories to just get more readers one way or another.
Niflheim wrote:That wasn't very much really. Since his entire theory hinged on one claim that he could not substantiate it didnt really need much. Had I gone all out you would have been greeted by a massive wall of text full of quotes
Just look at the part of where he named magic Miyuki uses. Inferno is a no brainer of what it is mythology wise. Niflheim however isnt where the dead go in norse mythology, not until later after the creation. In norse mythology the way you died and the choice of Odin decided where you went in the afterlife. So while on one level he is sort of right he is at the same time wrong for making such a simple destinction that once dead you end up in Niflheim. Cocytus isn't either the final destination in greek mythology, it is just 1 of the 5 rivers around hades with Styx being the famous one. This gets even more complicated when you consider the name Miya earned which is one of the other rivers as well, Mistress of Lethe.
I don't doubt that on some level Tatsuya is modeled after Shiva, the name given to him by the great asian alliance is Mahesvara and if i recall correct that is what Shiva is called in some buddhist work. But I won't do some great logical leap to imply all aspects of the deity Shiva will be incoperated into the character Tatsuya and that is simply because the entier mythology around Shiva is so complex even within hinduism.
His second post is even more depended on that his initial theory is correct. It also mixes up and embellishing around Parvati and Sati.
Going to climb down the walls now.
To be honest the more of these theories I work my way through the more I start to believe that the hinting of more than a sibling relationship is just a cheap ploy and bait, bloody brilliant one too, to instigate these types of theories to just get more readers one way or another.
Niflheim wrote:Well, it sounds like you agree with him. May I inquier as to way and on what points?crisisavatar wrote:Just going to quietly leave this here:
https://apps.facebook.com/forumforpages ... adc76fcc/0
***
Since I didnt ruin my laptop splurting coffee all over it reading that I'll jot down some general thoughts, just like most things that entier post lack any form of actual sources despite making an array of claims that really need some backing. I'll take one quote and take it from there.Since his entier theoyy hinges on this, this is something he needs to substantiate with either an interview with the author or other information that can be connected to the author. Without that it is just a fanboy rambling on about his desired ending and constructing his argument for it. Also even if the author has confirmed that the characters are based on deities from various mythologies to a certain extent, this guy is making the massive assumption that 'based on' equals ' mirrored on'. Thats not the only problem, not all views within Hinduism regards Shiva as the supreme god either, which further the need for sourcing. Further on Shiva is only refered to as the Destroyer or the Transformer within the hindu Trimurati, nothing about regeneration.To be specific: it has been confirmed that Tatsuya is HEAVILY based on Shiva, the Hindu God of Destruction and Regeneration, while Miyuki is based on various Goddesses of Death
Then we have the factually wrong statement that only deities marry thier sister. Honstly, I thought it was common knowledge that incesteus marriages were practiced in ancient egypt to a certain extent for the purpose of keeping the "blood clean". One blantly wrong "fact" puts him up the creek without a paddle.
However the best was actually the on the 4th line when he claimed he wasn't "fanboying" it. It is more or less unsubstantiated fan drivel and he keeps beating his own drum all the way to the end, it wasn't anything other than "fanboying". Going as far as hinting at a mathematical beauty with their school year, birthdays and time between births, guess it is true what they say that beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
With that said, and my previous posts on the subject, I guess I come off as someone that don't approve of this type of ending. Frankly speaking I don't care, I got my own thoughts and theory on the subject of who ends up with who in the end. It is just that many that wish for the incesteus ending tries to find random theories to justify it, when all they really need to say is that is what they want. The above link is a good example of it. We are all fans of the same series, yet that guy tries to be above that claiming he isnt "fanboying" to somehow make his theory more valid. All that while the entier post screams "fan boy!" with side tracking his reasoning and that annoying use of capsing words to emphasis them as if we are to dumb to get it otherwise.
They could always develop make the pairing official off-screen. Maybe give us heavy implications that they did indeed end up together--I think people would be satisfied as long as they have every reason to believe Tatsuya and Miyuki are still together in the end--even if it was never explicitly stated. I think there's still a chance for a more in-your-face ending though as, unlike OreImo, this is set in an alternate future world, so maybe it has more freedom when it comes to what it's allowed to get away with using the "it's a different world" excuse.keysersoze wrote:Incest ending is impossible..i felt it would have, had oreimo ended in the same. dengeki should make an exception for this one and let tats x miyuki pair end up together..well 4th world is made out into a villain now.
"at least" part, some1 of their back ground having already erased their background it shouldn't be forge it .As I was saying... Onii-sama and I are true siblings. Or at least that's what it says on the records, and DNA tests have always confirmed that relation.
While you do raise some good points, I think that's more along the lines of Miyuki having given up on not being Tatsuya's sister by being shown evidence of it. She doesn't want to be "just" his sister but is forced to believe so. I would say that it's feasable for the Yotsuba to have given DNA tests to a child (Tatsuya) born among their ranks who they've determined has disappointing Magic potential. Maybe they would've been curious as to whether or Not Tats was really a Yotsuba, Or maybe they've both been DNA tested several times for experimentation purposes.dunpeal wrote:On main topic, i have a little doubt if they are actually siblings. Back in volume 5 when shizuku was helping out honoka by separating miyuki from tatsuya and also asks if they were true sibling she answers as
"at least" part, some1 of their back ground having already erased their background it shouldn't be forge it .As I was saying... Onii-sama and I are true siblings. Or at least that's what it says on the records, and DNA tests have always confirmed that relation.
Also, "D.n.a test's always " sounds like multiple time they went through it. ( makes one think how loose their mum's personality was ) anyways why would they require that unless there was something suspicious somewhere.
Dont know if i am looking too much into it.
From my point of view the author have a very good idea of how the story will develop. If he had incest ending planned from the beginning then he might have done a deal with the publisher. (allow incest ending or I'll let someone else publish).NewAgeOfPower wrote:I was informed that Oreimo ended the way it did because the publisher (same publisher as Mahouka Koukou no Rettousei), Dengeki Bunko, specifically forbids incest.
I'm personally a Saegusa Mayumi fan (best troll ever), but an easy victory is hardly a victory.
While a nice thing to think about its impossible. Maya and Koichi were engaged but that ended because of Maya becoming infertile. It is possible. although extremely unlikly, of a MiyaxKoichi but there is absolutly no evidence of this.dunpeal wrote:Talking about mayumi, i would have loved tatsuya being a secret product of mayaXkoichi love, leaving opening for tatXmyuki coupling. Also making mayumi his half sister, who is stuck liking tatsuya like a brother and also more than a bro at the same time. Justice i guess.
Not being able to bear children is not the same as =impossible. I don't remember how it was specified in the text but it could be possible that she could have children through a surrogate mother.Mahesvara wrote:While a nice thing to think about its impossible. Maya and Koichi were engaged but that ended because of Maya becoming infertile. It is possible. although extremely unlikly, of a MiyaxKoichi but there is absolutly no evidence of this.dunpeal wrote:Talking about mayumi, i would have loved tatsuya being a secret product of mayaXkoichi love, leaving opening for tatXmyuki coupling. Also making mayumi his half sister, who is stuck liking tatsuya like a brother and also more than a bro at the same time. Justice i guess.