Mahouka-Does it become simpler later

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Mahouka-Does it become simpler later

Post by ArchmageXin »

I just started this series three days ago as something to read while on my daily commute to work...and...

This series don't appear to be bad, the author is a generic "genius blockhead oppressed by society norms"....alright. The usual women are interested in him, a bro-con sis. A couple male characters (interesting for a LN).

But then, I don't know why...but I am already start skipping paragraphs at volume 1. The author seem to go into WAY TO MUCH DETAILS. I start to read about tons upon tons of technical information. This is like...way exceeding any Star Trek stuff. A simple spell need 3-4 paragraphs of technical details to explain. So much it appear to make old school Kenshin look tame. And that duel between the VP at the first chapter? The duel end neat enough, then the whole group had to go into a lecture to show how cool the guy is. These details are even crowding out character development.

Is he trying to be G.R.R Martin of sci fi? Details are nice, but if I don't think even GRRM is going to spend a page worth of detail explaining the physics of water being poured out a jug.

It get better right guys? I really want to give this novel a chance.... :|

Edit: I am not against Technical details in any novel. But I am pretty sure even if I adsorb the details, I am not going to be casting spells IRL. I just don't see how the details add to the story, especially, it look like it is the majority of the story.
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Kadi
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by Kadi »

GRRM GRRRRM! GRRMgrrmgrrmgrrmgrrmmmm...

Sorry, I'll be serious now.


I agree that Mahouka is quite flawed, but not quite for the reasons as you. E.g. most of the girls you to view as budding love interests from what I understand aren't actually love interests. Well, not his, anyway. As for improving, the flaws I see don't get fixed later from what I've seen. Rather, they only get more pronounced the more time passes.


But to help you with you with your struggle to learn skills from reading LNs, may I suggest "Nareru! SE" to you? I think that's what it's called, anyway. It's about becoming a computer systems engineer from what I've heard. If I find other LNs that teach also skills, I'll be sure to tell you. Do you have a particular skill set you're interested in?


Grrm.


Edit: If manga are okay, too, how about Bartender? I heard it teaches a lot about all kinds of drinks, bartending and some other stuff. Possibly Gin no Saji, too, but I know too little about it to tell for sure...
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by Rohan123 »

I don't think that he meant that he's looking for works which teach him real life skills. I think what he meant was that the technical details in Mahouka are so in-depth that it goes beyond the point of fun-to-read and becomes useless and does not add to the story,(Disclaimer: His view,not mine) because even if you absorbed those details, they wouldn't actually help you do anything.
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Kadi
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by Kadi »

But reading something that "helps you do something"... wouldn't that be skills applicable in real life?


(everyone, sorry for derailing this into off topic so soon, but it really bugs me I might overlook something here)


P.S.: Eh... ehhh... ... "Yumeiro Pattissiere", manga about making cakes, sweets and the like!
"Oniichan... Did you just have your own ignition?" - Rika
『また兄さんに騙されました・・・・・・。これで通算482回目ですよ』-さくや
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ArchmageXin
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by ArchmageXin »

But to help you with you with your struggle to learn skills from reading LNs, may I suggest "Nareru! SE" to you? I think that's what it's called, anyway. It's about becoming a computer systems engineer from what I've heard. If I find other LNs that teach also skills, I'll be sure to tell you. Do you have a particular skill set you're interested in?
This actually sounds good. Is it in English? Reading in Chinese would give me a headache in no time -_-. I want learn comp sci definitely. Accounting is good but I am pretty sure Jap tax regulation isn't gonna match the US one.

Rohan123 wrote:I don't think that he meant that he's looking for works which teach him real life skills. I think what he meant was that the technical details in Mahouka are so in-depth that it goes beyond the point of fun-to-read and becomes useless and does not add to the story,(Disclaimer: His view,not mine) because even if you absorbed those details, they wouldn't actually help you do anything.
Exactly, that is what I am getting at. Most magic/sci-fi detailed novels tend not to go into too much detail, sure they will address mana, psy power or Warp Drive what ever, because the more detail you pour in the LESS realistic it gets. That is why Harry Potter shots fireball from Wands, without Rowling explaining how does the Wand work. People once people start focusing on the details, the magic would be gone or everyone will fall asleep.

The girls as his love interest/or not is not my concern. He could be sleeping with any/all/non of them and it would be ok. It is a classic LN plot for us to guess who will end up with the MC.
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by Kadi »

No, I don't think "Nareru! SE" has been translated into English yet. Or rather, I'd be surpri... it certainly sounds unique enough to make that one odd translator out there go nuts over it and actually translate it. Chances are bad, but you just might be in luck! (Read: Something inside me screams I read something about a translation of it somewhere, but I don't believe myself on this one. It's probably just my imagination, I'm afraid)


And... I see you like soft sci-fi, Mahouka tries to be hard sci-fi. Or at least it's too hard for your tastes. That's that, I guess.
"Oniichan... Did you just have your own ignition?" - Rika
『また兄さんに騙されました・・・・・・。これで通算482回目ですよ』-さくや
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『もきゅ!』
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by ArchmageXin »

Kadi wrote:No, I don't think "Nareru! SE" has been translated into English yet. Or rather, I'd be surpri... it certainly sounds unique enough to make that one odd translator out there go nuts over it and actually translate it. Chances are bad, but you just might be in luck! (Read: Something inside me screams I read something about a translation of it somewhere, but I don't believe myself on this one. It's probably just my imagination, I'm afraid)


And... I see you like soft sci-fi, Mahouka tries to be hard sci-fi. Or at least it's too hard for your tastes. That's that, I guess.
Yea, that summarize it. I think I am going to give up if volume 2 and this "science theories" don't stop. It tries to be more "deep" than all those JR Bunko 1-man-5-girls ratio harem stories, but gosh damn it, it can go way too deep. :lol:

Right now I am merely skipping paragraphs. If I am start to skipping entire chapters is a really bad sign.
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by Rohan123 »

ArchmageXin wrote: This actually sounds good. Is it in English? Reading in Chinese would give me a headache in no time -_-. I want learn comp sci definitely. Accounting is good but I am pretty sure Jap tax regulation isn't gonna match the US one.

Nareru SE teaser - Vol 1 prologue translated and Chapter 1 done 20%(active, but going slow) here at BT.
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by seitsuki »

Well as you said, the alternatives are pretty much all generic harems. Read one, you've read them all.
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by Mahesvara »

I completly disagree with the first post because, and you can go a head and call me strange, I enjoy the info dumps. As a person, I like to believe I am rather logical and base my beliefs on reason and hard facts. For those reasons however, I find it hard for myself to enjoy fantasy and scifi stories, expecially those that contain magic. I'm still surprised I was willing to start Mahouka in the first place. Stories that say "just cause", "because I said so", and "deal with it" when dealing with the unexplainable annoy me to no end. This is where Mahouka is different, it gives real answers to questions I have never seen answered and engrains it into science, witch just furthers my appreciation. I have no problems with fantasy and scifi stories if the author sets rules for the universe and follows those rules. I would love to go in more depth about this but alas! you are still in Volume 1. Because of these factors, it was those paragraphs of how magic worked and its analysis that has made Mahouka what it is to me, witch is one of the most enjoyable book serries I have ever read. I urge you to keep going and instead of seeing it as dull, think of how amazing it is. How those unanswered questions of countless stories get their long awaited answers. How brilliant the author is for being able to create and consistantly follow the rules of the universe he made. If you go into Mahouka with this mindset I believe it will become considerably more enjoyable. To be fair though, I do mainly read history books so I'm used to having this mindset. :D
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by larethian »

ArchmageXin wrote:I just started this series three days ago as something to read while on my daily commute to work...and...

This series don't appear to be bad, the author is a generic "genius blockhead oppressed by society norms"....alright. The usual women are interested in him, a bro-con sis. A couple male characters (interesting for a LN).

But then, I don't know why...but I am already start skipping paragraphs at volume 1. The author seem to go into WAY TO MUCH DETAILS. I start to read about tons upon tons of technical information. This is like...way exceeding any Star Trek stuff. A simple spell need 3-4 paragraphs of technical details to explain. So much it appear to make old school Kenshin look tame. And that duel between the VP at the first chapter? The duel end neat enough, then the whole group had to go into a lecture to show how cool the guy is. These details are even crowding out character development.

Is he trying to be G.R.R Martin of sci fi? Details are nice, but if I don't think even GRRM is going to spend a page worth of detail explaining the physics of water being poured out a jug.

It get better right guys? I really want to give this novel a chance.... :|

Edit: I am not against Technical details in any novel. But I am pretty sure even if I adsorb the details, I am not going to be casting spells IRL. I just don't see how the details add to the story, especially, it look like it is the majority of the story.
You don't like details in world building? It's not for you. Give it up. The thing about the magic in Mahouka is that it's very well thought out with strong basis (though fictional) in (quantum) physics and computer science and not random BS crap that some authors try to pull with poor understanding of the subject matter they talk about. If you can't handle that, stop before it's too late.

The world building is actually the strength of the series. Also, the protag does have a good reason for being a 'blockhead', you missed a lot of foreshadowing by skipping stuff. The detailed nuances actually gave hints to why he's like that. However, to be objective, the weakest part of Mahouka is the characters which makes the series suffer a lot in my opinion. Characterizations are quite weak and don't evolve much. In the second year arc, I'm already getting tired of some the same old shit with the character interaction. I'm NOT talking about character backstories which are decent enough, but the interactions in school are very much same old shit to some level, just sometimes with new characters lol.
YOU DARE MOCK ME(yr 1) YOU WEED(yr 2) --> GETS PAWNED --> WTF DID YOU DO!? lol lol lol
The only thing I look forward to now is the stuff at the world and clan power level conflicts. With respect to harem, sure, girls are gathering around the protag but nothing really happens. You don't get panties shots, flipped skirts, and a "kya" every page.

On another note again, you shouldn't bother continuing reading if you skip the details. Without knowing the details, you won't be able to understand how a person got bested in a fight and the power levels in the story won't mean a thing to you.
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by Niflheim »

ArchmageXin wrote:I just started this series three days ago as something to read while on my daily commute to work...and...

This series don't appear to be bad, the author is a generic "genius blockhead oppressed by society norms"....alright. The usual women are interested in him, a bro-con sis. A couple male characters (interesting for a LN).

But then, I don't know why...but I am already start skipping paragraphs at volume 1. The author seem to go into WAY TO MUCH DETAILS. I start to read about tons upon tons of technical information. This is like...way exceeding any Star Trek stuff. A simple spell need 3-4 paragraphs of technical details to explain. So much it appear to make old school Kenshin look tame. And that duel between the VP at the first chapter? The duel end neat enough, then the whole group had to go into a lecture to show how cool the guy is. These details are even crowding out character development.

Is he trying to be G.R.R Martin of sci fi? Details are nice, but if I don't think even GRRM is going to spend a page worth of detail explaining the physics of water being poured out a jug.

It get better right guys? I really want to give this novel a chance.... :|

Edit: I am not against Technical details in any novel. But I am pretty sure even if I adsorb the details, I am not going to be casting spells IRL. I just don't see how the details add to the story, especially, it look like it is the majority of the story.
If you started skipping the information around the magic and so on I can only agree with Iarethian, bow out now because it doesnt become any less of it as you go on, you will also miss out on a lot of the story. You could say that great power isnt absolute in this story and you will be left in the dark as to the why this is when you skip all the detailed information. The large amount of details add to the world building as well, it isnt your generic humans tapping into some ancient well of power no one knew how and when started, they don't go off to the mountains for special training and come back twice as strong for the next villian etc.
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by ArchmageXin »

First of all, there is no need to start flaming. I was only asking a question.

I really don't care if a series come with a ton of boob fondling and panty shots. If they want to go that route, they go, if they don't, they don't.

Like I said, he can make up a ton of pseudo-science, but as far as I can tell, non of it has any value other than filling up space in his world. The work of psion is interesting, but they can't keep filling the chapter with this kind of information. You are very right there are some underling detail about the interest in family line, quite a bit of prejudice targeting the MC due to his magic limitations, and something foreshadowed about his dad using him as a slave, but in the end, it is being crowded out by his wonder-science.

It is like my old college professor, who would fill the class with stories of his youth at a major stock exchange for 20+ min, then suddenly say, "by the way, the way to execute a double split trade with a call option is...."

larethian, you don't need to get defensive. I fully appreciate the amount of effort you made into the series (and everyone know my contribution to baka is way behind yours). I am only asking people if at certain point, the author cut the science to a readable limit and focus on the story, and not on puedo magic or a history lesson on the 21st century equivalent of a spoon.
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by SXIII »

ArchmageXin wrote:First of all, there is no need to start flaming. I was only asking a question.

I really don't care if a series come with a ton of boob fondling and panty shots. If they want to go that route, they go, if they don't, they don't.

Like I said, he can make up a ton of pseudo-science, but as far as I can tell, non of it has any value other than filling up space in his world. The work of psion is interesting, but they can't keep filling the chapter with this kind of information. You are very right there are some underling detail about the interest in family line, quite a bit of prejudice targeting the MC due to his magic limitations, and something foreshadowed about his dad using him as a slave, but in the end, it is being crowded out by his wonder-science.

It is like my old college professor, who would fill the class with stories of his youth at a major stock exchange for 20+ min, then suddenly say, "by the way, the way to execute a double split trade with a call option is...."

larethian, you don't need to get defensive. I fully appreciate the amount of effort you made into the series (and everyone know my contribution to baka is way behind yours). I am only asking people if at certain point, the author cut the science to a readable limit and focus on the story, and not on puedo magic or a history lesson on the 21st century equivalent of a spoon.
Only a bit and that depends on the volume (story arcs here last 2-3 volumes). If you don't like that, this series is not for you.
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Re: Mahouka-Does it get better later? (@volume 1)

Post by Niflheim »

ArchmageXin wrote: ... I am only asking people if at certain point, the author cut the science to a readable limit and focus on the story, and not on puedo magic or a history lesson on the 21st century equivalent of a spoon.
The short answer to that is a simple 'No'. When a new magic or concept is introduced it is followed by a detailed explanation as to what it is and does, and you see them pop up in each volume with pretty much each new character introduced. As for what would be a readable limit I honestly can't say since I got no issue with it as is. But I'm one of thoes that after read Bilbo and Lord of the rings went out and read every other book published (and this isnt just 1 or 2) with the Middle Earth history, extra stories, languages and all the rest.
Riso raknar, rann álfraudull, nordr at niflheim
nióla sótti; upp nam ár Giöll Úlfrúnar nidr,
hornþytvalldr Himinbiarga

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Give me KanColle in english please Kadokawa Games!
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