Kyoukai Senjou no Horizon

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How did you find reading Kyoukai Senjou no Horizon ?

It was good! Please do more!
730
96%
It was interesting.
22
3%
Not as good as I thought.
5
1%
Boring. Not touching it again.
2
0%
 
Total votes: 759

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MisaoFan93
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Kyoukai Senjou no Horizon

Post by MisaoFan93 »

Title : Kyokai Senjou no Horizon (境界線上のホライゾン, Horizon on the Middle of Nowhere)
Year : 2008
Author : Minoru Kawakami (川上稔, Kawakami Minoru)
Illustrator : Satoyasu (さとやす)
Genre : Science-fiction, Fantasy
Publisher : ASCII Media Works
Number of volumes : 7

Plot Summary : In the far future, humans abandon the devastated Earth and move to the upper world "Tenjo". But Tenjo and the law of causation collapse by a war and humans returns to the Earth, which has turns into an inhabitable planet except for Shinshu area. Shinshu is too small to accommodate all the humans, so they duplicate the are and create "Juso Sekai". In order to rebuild Tenjo and the law of causation, the returned humans start reproduction of history from B.C. 10,000. When the reproduction completes until A.D. 1413, a war breaks out in Shinshu and Juso Sekai falls onto the original world. The humans living in Juso Sekai lose their land and invade the original world. People in Shinshu surrender and is divided by the invaders from Juso Sekai. They try to resume the history reproduction from A.D.1457, but the update of history terminates in A.D.1648. A rumor of apocalypse begins to spread the world.

A anime adaptation by Sunrise is slated to be aired this October. Please translate this novel before the anime starts.
Last edited by cautr on Sun Feb 02, 2014 8:20 am, edited 6 times in total.
Reason: changed typo in title
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by Mystes »

Do you actually know the novels?
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by Darklor »

I dont think that it would be possible. First I dont think that we have at the moment any in this series interested translators - otherwise there would have been a rumor. Second I even think that it wouldnt be possible to translate that until october since here are ususaly no professional translators, but fan translators which have usualy also RL time issues themself.
Please don't mind my bad english since I'm german.

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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by Mystes »

Add to that time issue. I don't think it's possible for a translator to do it in this little amount of time.
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by Imoutolover »

I don't if this is the right place, but I don't want to create another thread so let me put here a "teaser" of the first volume. But before that some considerations:

I did it in a hurry and it's the first time I tried to translate seriously something to english, so I'm sure that there are a lot of mistakes, but if you still don't mind, then continue reading =P

Some terms are like this: Term* (Rough translation or a simple definition)

Other ones:

Jud. = Something like Roger, Yes;
Loizmoi Oplo = The ancient greek term that refers to some weapons that can be roughly translated to english as "Mortal sins' armament"

*If you want to avoid heavy spoilers from this series because of the anime that starts in october, don't read the rest of this post!
Volume 1 <Ge> - Chapter 41: Above the parallel lines of the ones who are in confrontation (half? of the chapter)
Putting inside spoilers, just to prevent that anything "bad" happens:
Spoiler! :
Toori, in the middle of the battlefield, said.
“Really.”
“To put it bluntly, I don’t know the meaning of this “Really” that you have said.”
“Don’t mind it. ––––Because now I’m gonna save you.”
Soon after that came a reaction.
“Don’t you understand that Horizon’s death is for the sake of the world? Horizon wishes to do the best choice of not causing trouble to the world, so intervention from others is uninvited. This is the right answer.”
“Hah?”
Toori folded his arms behind his head. And looking to Horizon,
“Like I care about the world. It’s troublesome to me if you die.”
“Let me do a question, ––––Between the world and you, what is more important?”
“What do you think?”
“To put it bluntly, ––––It’s the world.”
“So, it’s done.”
Toori said. He breathed,
“I just have to be a king that governs the entire world. It’s like this, right?”

In everyplace of the world that received this transmission, the people who had interest in him, looked and heard.
“It’s not a dream to save the Last Days and be the king of the world if I have your Loizmoi Oplo. And the Loizmoi Oplo are your feelings so if I gather them, you’ll regain old self.”
So,
“I from now on, understand? F-r-o-m n-o-w o-n, from now on. From now on, I, together with you Horizon, am going to conquer the world. Freeing the Last Days, flirting, ––––I’m going to recover all of you that was stolen because of me.”
And, the voice, turned here.
“Because of that I request to the entire world, it can be just for the sake of freeing the Last Days, can’t you give the Loizmoi Oplo to me? If you don’t want, then let’s go to war. If you don’t like the sound of war, than, battle, clashing, confrontation, negotiation, it can be anything. It doesn’t matter what you use. It can be anything if it can be an excuse to recover Horizon’s feelings.”
Yes.
“––––Shintoism, Buddhism, Catholicism, Protestantism, Murasai* (Another religion), Anglican Church, Russian Orthodox Church, Hinduism, Taoism, Technomagi* (Magic), Kenjutsu, Hand-to-hand combat techniques, Gun techniques, Horse-riding, Mobile armors, Bushin* (Mechas), Mechanic Beasts, Kiou* (???), Mechanic Dragons, Aerial Battleships, Humans, Izoku* (Other races in general?),Citizens, Knights, Yeomen, Samurais, Ninjas, Warriors, Kings, Nobles, Monarchs, Emperors, Pope, Kyokutou* (A “country”), K.P.A.Italia, Tres Espana, Hexagon Franceise, England, Soviet Russia, P.A.ODA, Shin, Indo Federation, Money, Authority, Negotiations, Politics, Public opinion, Military power, Information, Shinkaku Busou* (Divine status equipment), Loizmoi Oplo, Seifu Kensou* (Seifu’s ???), Gotaichou* (The Top Five), Hachidairyuuou* (Big Eight Dragon Kings), President of the Union, President of the Student Council, Men, Women, those who aren’t any of them, Young ones, Old ones, those who are alive, those who are dead, and Musashi who will use their forces to confront and our and yours emotions and reasons and will and, others, so much more, much more of other things that I don’t know, that are inside everyone–––– “
He confessed.
“––––Let’s see who is the strongest.”

Masazumi stopped breathing.
… It’s too absurd…!
What are you doing inciting war in a situation like this? Starting with the Seiren, all other countries are going to be cautious and turn into enemies. But, the words continued,
“Be it a peaceful solution or an aggressive solution, the one who wins at the end is the world’s King. –After all, this guy is gonna save the Last Days.”
The idiot, with that talk of saving the world, the Last Days, paralleled everything.
“What do you think?”
Mitotsudaira who was at my side asked me with a smile. She, with the sound of battle behind her,
“––––Aren’t you probably in the world’s most worthwile Kyoudouin* (School)?”
Masazumi couldn’t answer her question, only, Toori’s voice,
“What do you think about this rule? In short, … Huh?”
… What is the meaning of this Huh?
But in the other side of the sign-frame Toori was looking confused to this side and inclined his head in several degrees.
“Huh? Hey? I…, was gonna confess, so why I’m doing a proclamation of world domination? Huh? Huuh?”
“Think before talking––––!!”
Everyone that was in the battlefield, even the enemies made a tsukkomi. In that moment, Horizon who was on the other side of Toori, nodded sometimes and said.
“Indeed, ––––I can conclude that your logic is clear and easy to understand.”
“Eh!? Seriously!?”
“Uwaa––––! Don’t incite the idiot!!”
But,
“I can impartially conclude that this is your logic and not Horizon’s logic. Each other is in parallel lines, so in the end it’s still a nuisance to Horizon.”
Horizon waggled her head to the side.
“Please, leave. Horizon wants to avoid that Kyokutou will be in a loss because of my existence.”
“Even if I say that I don’t want to lose you?”
“Why do you say that?”
“Eh? I, It’s… Weeell,you knoow, it’s embarrassing to say in front of the others.”
“Don’t be embarrassed––!!”
And so, in the right side of the sign-frame Tenzou appeared in an instant while he was hiding. Soon, he showed his figure and,
“Lord Toori, ––––, huh? It’s not over yet? Do, do it fast and retreat! Tch, we are in the limit of standing against the Pope! Wrap it! Wrap it!!”
“Hey, hey you guys are even trying to rush me? It can’t be helped.”
Then, Toori breathed and declared into Horizon’s direction.
“There is a lot, but… Of course it’s because I love you.”
He said. The girls from the command post raised her voices and said Waa.
But, in the next moment, Masazumi heard. Horizon waggled her head twice to below,
“Jud., it’s really a shame, but Horizon is an automaton and don’t have feelings, so didn’t understand the meaning of your words. ––––Please, leave.”
“Uwaa––––!”
Everybody screamed.
“At this last moment he was dumped!!”

At the command post, Suzu almost fell again.
“Ah, Su, Suzu-san, thi, this time the cushion isn’t a wicked one––.”
“Kukuku, miko that have shock-resisting boobs. What do you think? ––––Horizon’s degree isn’t even bigger from that time?”
“Ye, Yes, I think so too. To think that the performance against Toori-kun could improve…”
“I, I won’t lose!”
Toori shouted.
“If I gather the Loizmoi Oplo, your feelings will come back. When this time comes I’ll make you regret your words you said no––––, it’s not that! Foul language, no good! So, well, sorry, please give one more chance.”
“Oh my, you started assuming a humble attitude? I can conclude that this is a good decision. ––––But it’s useless. Because I’m going to die.”
Everyone thought what kind of talk was that, but Horizon with her eyes half opened,
“In the first place, I had never heard of someone confessing to an automaton. It’s a doll, isn’t it?”
“I, Idiot! You’re really an idiot! I am really fine with automatons too!”
Toori spread his arms and said.
“I too, when I saw you for the first time, wondered and thought a little like that too. But, you, when you’re serving in the shop, don’t you bend like this when a spoon falls?”
“Digging up my memories, ––––Yes, I really bended.”
“Ooh, so when this happened I, like this, I became aware of the me who was looking at the space between your legs in a low angle. ––––Even with automatons my instinct doesn’t matter. And yesterday, because Mitotsudaira, who was no-bra, let me touch her breasts, I discovered that I’m fine even with the hard ones! ––––I can do it!!”
“He, Hey, Don’t say false things!!”
Horizon nodded, while ignored Mitotsudaira’s intervention. She expressionlessly,
“HA HA HA, To put it bluntly, ––––It’s the worst.”
It’s over, someone whispered and everyone nodded.
But, everyone heard. Horizon’s,
“I can conclude that Horizon and you are, actually, in parallel lines.”
For some reason, she, with some relief in her voice,
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––Please, leave.”

To these words, Masazumi raised her eyes, surprised. Immediately,
“Aoi!! Don’t give up!!”
… If it’s on parallel lines ––––.
I have to say. I know it. What she really wishes.
I understood. Therefore I’ll say it. I opened my mouth, but,
“Don’t worry, Seejun. … I understood too. This is a mutual crush of arguments.”
Let me see, and Toori said for a start,
“Then it’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say too. ––––I’ll take you back.”

Toori stepped once to the front.
He stays right before the light wall.
And, Horizon does the same.
After that, she opens her mouth.
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––There isn’t a place where we can agree with each other.”
Replying, he opens his mouth. Well, while thinking,
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it too, ––––I know the place where we can agree with each other.”
And she continued,
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––You can’t do anything, can you?”
As he is connecting,
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it too. ––––I think I can do something for you.”
Replying,
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––Horizon wishes for her death.”
Answering,
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it too. ––––I want you to live.”
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––Horizon doesn’t have a person’s life.”
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it too. ––––I know that you have a person’s soul.”
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––Automaton doesn’t have feelings.”
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it too. ––––I’ll recover your feelings.”
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––Everything is pointless.”
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it too. ––––I don’t think that there isn’t anything pointless about you.”
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––An automaton’s decision is perfect.”
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it too. ––––I don’t think that your decision is perfect.”
After saying all these words, Horizon took a breath. And on top of that,
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says.”
Taking a breath.
“––––Horizon doesn’t want to hear your answers.”

In an instant. In the corner of the battlefield, Masazumi screamed.
“Aoi!! … Don’t let her go!!”
In the next moment. Masazumi heard.
His voice was, slowly, confirming her words.
“You don’t wanna hear my answers. But you know, this too ––––“
He said.
“Is the parallel lines between us.”
So,
“So, I’ll say it too. Because we’re on parallel lines.”
Aoi took a breath,
“––––I want to hear your answer.”
To these words, Horizon moved.
She just, waggled her head below.
Nodded, as confirming, she bowed her head,
“––––Jud.”
She raised her head.

At the command post, everyone was in silence, looking at the sign-frame.
Inside the screen, in front of automaton that nodded, Toori left out the strength of his body and, well, was thinking.
In front of him. On the other side of the light, it’s possible to see Horizon but,
“She is waiting, right. What question will be done?”
At the indication of Asama’s words, Horizon was, without hurrying him or ignoring him, just, just waiting,
“––––Go ahead. We are on the parallel lines, so because of everything that was already said, Horizon has the duty of replying,”
Is that so, and Toori nodded.
So, he,
“Everything is on parallel lines.”
After a preliminary remark, he said.
“So, I’ll say it. ––––Is your decision really perfect?”
Then,
“It’s on parallel lines.”
She, too, made a preliminary remark and connected the words.
“Therefore, Horizon says. ––––Horizon is surely wrong.”
To this remark, to the content that showed her own mistake, everyone stopped breathing.
“Why, an automaton that always obeys the best decision, said her own mistake….?”
“It’s the behavior of an automaton.”
Neshimbara says.
“As automaton always answers the best decision. That’s why Ariadust-kun answers that her death is the best decision of what she has to do now. But…, not always the best decision is the same as what the automaton really wants. Below the best decision there must be other candidates.”
That’s why,
“She was waiting. Someone that would make her not obeys the best decision, persuade her, someone that wouldn’t give up on her. ––––And that idiot discovered that.”
The answer is,
“To someone that doesn’t accept the best decision, the best is to reply exactly the opposite of the best decision.”
As Neshimbara pointed, it can be heard from the transmission.
This was the same replies from before,
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it. ––––You think that everything about you is pointless, right?”
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––I don’t want to think that anything from me is pointless.”
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it. ––––You don’t have feelings, right?”
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––I believe that I have feelings.”
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it. ––––You don’t have a person’s life, right?”
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––Horizon does have a person’s soul.”
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it. ––––You wish for your own death, right?”
Answering,
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––Horizon wants to live.”
Replying,
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it. ––––I think that I can’t do anything for you, right?”
As she is connecting,
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––You can do something.”
So, he continued,
“It’s on parallel lines. So, I’ll say it. ––––There isn’t any place that we can understand each other.”
Answering, she opens her mouth. After breathing once, as she was complaining,
“It’s on parallel lines. Therefore, Horizon says. ––––Horizon knows the place where we can understand each other.”
“This is ––––”
Toori asked.
“Where is this Horizon? Where is this place where we on parallel lines can understand each other?”
“Jud., ––––This is in the place where the parallel lines pile up, the place where the different points of view reach a consensus. This is ––––”
Horizon answered.
“––––Above the boundary line (Kyoukai Senjou).”

Toori ignored the sound of the battlefield, everything, and just asked.
“Horizon doesn’t want to go to above the boundary line, right?”
“No, ––––I want to.”
“You don’t want that someone takes you there, right?”
“No, please take me.”
Is that so,
“I’m a guy that can’t do anything, you know?”
“No, you can do anything.”
Is that so,
“Later, I can’t touch your boobs, right?”
“––––Hah? …What are you saying?”
“It, it’s her normal reaction! Not on the parallel lines, a normal answer came!!”
“Go die.”
“To do that in this timing is really…”
“Do you understand? If we’re going to show it in a form of a graph, your stocks raised a lot, and in the next instant they went to the bottom…”
“Shu, shut up you guys! …Horizon, are you angry? You are angry, right?”
“What makes you think like that? I can affirm that Horizon isn’t angry at all.”
“This means that you’re really angry!!”
But Horizon, was just standing still at the other side of the light curtain. She entwined her hands,
“You really deny Horizon, don’t you?”
“Horizon can deny me, hit me, make a tsukkomi* on me, you know.”
So, Horizon said.
“The best is that Horizon stays as a monarch. But Horizon thinks that is good to be an employee at the luncheonette. ––––What are you going to do about this?”
To this question, Toori inclined his head. Hah? And he inclined his head even more and said.
“It’s easy. ––––You can be a monarch that works as an employee at a luncheonette.”
After all,
“I am the president of the Union and the Student Council, but, ––––I’m doing an idiot too, you know?”
In response to this answer Horizon moved. She, opened her mouth, bended her head,
“Jud. …! Frankly speaking––––“
Horizon nodded vigorously. And so she, after bowing her head, raised her voice.
“––––Horizon wants to make this the best decision…!”
Toori nodded too. Ah, and, after a smile spread on his face, he raised his voice too.
“Me too Horizon!!”
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by larethian »

your teaser is long enough to be posted on the wiki. and you're a brave soul if you were to work on this, as brave as me working on 38-volume denyuuden.
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by Imoutolover »

Ok, created a page for this on the wiki: http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index ... no_Horizon

Don't know if I'm supossed to create a thread in the Teaser Feedback section or if this topic will be the one for the feedback, so I left the page in the wiki without a link to a feedback thread.

@larethian: I'm (still?) not a brave soul like you larethian, the most I can do are some random translations like this one :lol:
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by larethian »

Imoutolover wrote:Ok, created a page for this on the wiki: http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index ... no_Horizon

Don't know if I'm supossed to create a thread in the Teaser Feedback section or if this topic will be the one for the feedback, so I left the page in the wiki without a link to a feedback thread.

@larethian: I'm (still?) not a brave soul like you larethian, the most I can do are some random translations like this one :lol:
don't worry, there's a in-house feedback thread maker. oh, no worries, we promise we'll suck you in somehow. :lol:
besides, your 3 to 4 hours of effort (based on my estimate) don't seem that random to me. :D who are you on AS?
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by Imoutolover »

larethian wrote:
Imoutolover wrote:Ok, created a page for this on the wiki: http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index ... no_Horizon

Don't know if I'm supossed to create a thread in the Teaser Feedback section or if this topic will be the one for the feedback, so I left the page in the wiki without a link to a feedback thread.

@larethian: I'm (still?) not a brave soul like you larethian, the most I can do are some random translations like this one :lol:
don't worry, there's a in-house feedback thread maker. oh, no worries, we promise we'll suck you in somehow. :lol:
besides, your 3 to 4 hours of effort (based on my estimate) don't seem that random to me. :D who are you on AS?
Let's see how you will try to do that. :D

Btw, you estimated that time by your own experience? Beacuse it really took me something like that (probably a little more) to translate everything...

And in the AS my nick is probably the one you have in mind, Allen.
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by larethian »

Yes, optimally, through my experience from a few titles, I've found that it's impossible to go beyond 5-6KB worth (~5 pages) of text per hour, and that's only when the text is easy and I'm very used to the author, and when I don't care too much on quality.
Most of the time, for most LNs of average difficulty (not like Shana or Nishio's LNs), an average of 3.5-4KB per hour (not counting research and break times) should be decent speed. Moreover, for me, I need to take a break every hour because my attention span suffers. So I've never managed to translate more than 20-25KB in a day over a period of 6-8 hours.
You posted 17KB worth of text, so I reckon that it's impossible to do it in less than 3 hours. I don't know the difficulty level of Horizon, so the upper bound if the language is of average difficulty will probably be around 4+ hours (excluding cultural/reference research and break times, as well as proofreading, checking, etc; if you include these, it will definitely be more). :D
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by Imoutolover »

Oh, it's very interesting to know that. Now, I'm really afraid to ask how many KB/hour someone like Teh Ping can translate because to me Itsuten's translations are kind of fast, at least more than most of the series in the B-T now... One more reason to see that poll with other eyes :lol:

Horizon is probably on an average level with some scenes that can easily be something that can appear in BakaTest, but it does have some scenes that are kind of complicated to understand (because of some ネタ or the 中二 setting or because it refers to some historic facts). Luckily what I translated was more on a easy level.
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by larethian »

no, actually, IS is faster despite the fact that the translator is working on 3 novels.
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by Darklor »

Imoutolover wrote:Ok, created a page for this on the wiki: http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index ... no_Horizon

Don't know if I'm supossed to create a thread in the Teaser Feedback section or if this topic will be the one for the feedback, so I left the page in the wiki without a link to a feedback thread.

@larethian: I'm (still?) not a brave soul like you larethian, the most I can do are some random translations like this one :lol:
There is no problem you could do that too
Please don't mind my bad english since I'm german.

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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by Megami Alice »

I've only read the prologue and I find that the difficulty comes with:
1) The author's occasional lack of explanation. Sometimes it is hard to picture the scene, the author's style of oblique depiction and the choice of unusual words complements the difficulty.
2) The amount of terminologies. Won't be too much of a problem once you get used to it.
3) The introduction of slews of characters in the beginning. Most of Tohri's classmates are introduced in the prologue, and if I recall correctly, there's like 22 of them I think, each has their own unique quirks and antics. Since the starter readers have no idea about the character relationships, much of their actions/dialogues won't click until rereading (once you get to know them).

Those aforementioned 3 may daunt the translators and even readers, but thankfully there was a glossary, character synopsis and a brief explanation for the universe's history/setting at the start of the page.

Image
(Index 1-19 on left, Horizon 1-7 on right)
As you can see, it rivals Index in terms of number of pages.

Vol.1 (1-A) 541pp
Vol.2 (1-B) 769pp
Vol.3 (2-A) 903pp
Vol. 4 (2-B) 1,151pp (yes, over 1000 pages)
Vol. 5 (3-A) 735pp
Vol. 6 (3-B) 831pp
Vol. 7 (3-C) 895pp
Vol. 8 (4-A) 671pp

That's a total of 6469 pages or like 19 and a half volumes of average Dengeki Bunko novel (330pp).
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Veruz
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Re: Kyokai Senjou no Horizon

Post by Veruz »

So I stumbled upon the anime adaptation of this novel while I checked the new releases for this season. The summary seemed interesting, so I gave it a try. While next to no info has been really revealed in the anime, I thought that this might become an entertaining read. So what to do? Head over to Baka Tsuki of course and check if anyone had picked up the project. Found this topic, got my hopes up a bit. But after seeing just the sheer amount of pages in printed form that Megami Alice posted... Better not really expect much out of this one. Translators are busy with more important project and I can see even people that try themselves at this one become discouraged fast because of the volume (I am no expert, but those seem of course waaaaay bigger than your average light novel).

The anime may catch the interest of some more people, but given it is only a 13 episode adaption (coupled with the fact that it will most likely be run over with fanservice) I don't see anyone picking this up sooner or later - Well, maybe if it gets the same hype, recongnition, fanbase by the western people as Index (I am in no way saying that the anime was the spark for the translation, just that it may have pulled more people into the LN version).
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