Anime Culture Shock

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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby ainsoph9 » Thu Mar 08, 2012 4:43 pm

Well, Shinbou Akiyuki is a genius.

The funny thing about the talk is that it is not the usual trash talk you hear before a fight most of the time. A lot of the time characters give soliloquies on their life stories, which cause viewers to think, "We do NOT care!"
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby shichinanatsu » Thu Mar 08, 2012 4:47 pm

ah, fights with words over fights with fists/weapons/spells.. kinda annoying for Shana final to be like that in recent eps, probably even in previous seasons.. not to mention naruto and bleach, though not as often..
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby Rednal » Thu Mar 08, 2012 4:53 pm

There are ways to make characters sympathetic without having them do their life stories in the middle of battle.

A good example of this: Nanoha A's.

I suppose it's important to show that your ideas are more powerful, and brute force isn't all that matters, but... y'know... it can absolutely be done better.




On topic, what one thing shocked you the most when you first saw it?
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby ainsoph9 » Thu Mar 08, 2012 4:54 pm

A certain event from Full Moon o Sagashite. It put me into a three day depression.
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby Cosmic Eagle » Thu Mar 08, 2012 5:12 pm

ainsoph9 wrote:
YoakeNoHikari wrote:Well, if seeing a naked person of the opposite gender does not give you some sort of sexual arousal, it comes across as seeing/smelling gourmet food and not getting hungry or salivating. (Poor comparison, I know.) Unless you are a monk, this sort of disconnect seems unnatural in a sense. You say that it is the "same physical template basically," but the physical side of things also tends to imply man's carnal desires. If you think about it, humans are sexual creatures. The average man thinks about sex several times per hour, and women are not that much better. Seeing the naked human body probably does not help decrease this count.


I don't know how it is to other people but to me, the situation plays a bigger role than bare nudity....I mean if it's a mixed bath, drama display or any other similar non-sexual situation where your goal is to bathe/swim/art whatever it won't arouse me.

I'm not actually sure if that's the norm...

The most extreme example I can think of would be say...a spiritual or art display where the subjects are nude purely to display the basicness of the soul and other such concepts and then if an audience member just things about sex.....that's just him not being able to enjoy something finer and more beautiful than just sex I suppose

Nudity is more than sexuality after all....it has always been that way to me since young so it's kind of a given in my mind. Might be just spiritual difference..
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby Cosmic Eagle » Thu Mar 08, 2012 5:16 pm

ainsoph9 wrote:A certain event from Full Moon o Sagashite. It put me into a three day depression.


That whole story is nakige so you're not alone...
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby hobogunner » Thu Mar 08, 2012 5:26 pm

Cosmic Eagle wrote:I don't know how it is to other people but to me, the situation plays a bigger role than bare nudity....I mean if it's a mixed bath, drama display or any other similar non-sexual situation where your goal is to bathe/swim/art whatever it won't arouse me.

I'm not actually sure if that's the norm...

The most extreme example I can think of would be say...a spiritual or art display where the subjects are nude purely to display the basicness of the soul and other such concepts and then if an audience member just things about sex.....that's just him not being able to enjoy something finer and more beautiful than just sex I suppose

Nudity is more than sexuality after all....it has always been that way to me since young so it's kind of a given in my mind. Might be just spiritual difference..


Well, it's all entirely situational; however, at it's core, it's just human differences. I mean, if you grow up with a sculptor as a father who portrayed, say, a woman's sexuality in his works, you wouldn't view a woman's body as someone who has only known it as almost a sexual device. Religion and belief ties into this as well, but at it's core, the way it is seen will vary from person to person, since no 2 people will share the same set of beliefs, religion, or upbringing.

Now, certainly BOT.....I have nothing, so default to Cosmic's post above mine.
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby shichinanatsu » Thu Mar 08, 2012 5:26 pm

@ Rednal: most shocking event? hmm.. more like a cliffhanger, but the True End of Da Capo II, as in the last few scenes and some character's appearance.. closely tied though is To Heart 2 Ruuko end..
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby ainsoph9 » Sun Jun 30, 2013 6:29 pm

I am necroposting on this topic because I do not want to start another one. :wink:

Frankly, there have been some shifts in trends of what is considered popular in anime culturally speaking as of late. One of these is the whole imouto/incest/sis-con/bro-con thing that seems to be coming from LNs/VNs. Obviously, many Westerners find this kind of thing to be culture shock of sorts. What do you think about this? How do you feel about this? Where do you draw the line? Is there a line to begin with for you?
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby shichinanatsu » Tue Jul 02, 2013 12:45 am

you noticed it as well?? 8) not too sure on the LN side, but with VNs the trend's been particularly strong since at least '09 (as far back as the majority of my titles take me back)

i found it odd too, but it isn't much of a surprise when you consider that the trend itself feeds on (the wallets of) Type B otaku :? . i guess the question left for us non-japs is, why exactly does it trigger our jap comrades' fancy? also, there seems to be an unclear line between moe for protag's ane/imouto, and moe for the ane/imouto concept in general. i don't mind the former as long as its properly (note: bare minimum) delivered, but apparently them Type B's extend too much into the latter.

i might be an exception amongst my nation's general populace with their thoughts, convictions, and standards, but imo incest can be a good thing, AS LONG as its in unglorified 2D. 3D manifestations of incestuous romance and marriage are out of the question, and that doesn't even factor in how incest can be a criminal offense in many nations. though, IDEALLY (and this is my very personal opinion), if one were to look only on the evolutionary ultimatum against incest, which could be said as the origin of the social taboo, incestuous lovers ought to be given the chance to belong in society like your typical man and wife, AFTER agreeing to not contribute to the gene pool (some sort of social contract that binds incestuous couples to sterilization as well as being banned from artificial conception methods that might be developed in the near future). then again, no nation and constitution has even come close to such an idea, and probably never will. :(
Spoiler! :
oversimplifying things - and i might be wrong - in the West incest is both taboo and off-limits, while in Japan its only taboo. the same cultural dissonance pretty much applies to the loli genre as well. in that regard, it becomes a responsibility for literary agent to develop the incestuous/loli romance enough to transcend taboo restrictions. then again, in reality that's too much to ask, because the dumb customer that is your typical Type B pretty much judges his/her prey with a heavy bias on character art. so much for asking for a lifelong experience with a LN/VN at least once a year.. :cry:

the best titles i can think of are:
Sakura Musubi [aug '05]
Natsu no Ame [sept '09]
Real Imouto... [may '10]
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby ainsoph9 » Tue Jul 02, 2013 7:07 pm

you noticed it as well?? not too sure on the LN side, but with VNs the trend's been particularly strong since at least '09 (as far back as the majority of my titles take me back)


It is kind of hard to miss, even on the anime side, where much of this is getting ported from.

i found it odd too, but it isn't much of a surprise when you consider that the trend itself feeds on (the wallets of) Type B otaku . i guess the question left for us non-japs is, why exactly does it trigger our jap comrades' fancy? also, there seems to be an unclear line between moe for protag's ane/imouto, and moe for the ane/imouto concept in general. i don't mind the former as long as its properly (note: bare minimum) delivered, but apparently them Type B's extend too much into the latter.


Spoiler! :
Like you said, I do not mind the over- and undertones too much, although it gets quite old too quickly. The blurring of the lines between incest and moe seems to be problematic on one level or another. Obviously, from a moral perspective, especially a Western one, this is a big no-no. Westerners do not have as nearly as much of a problem with cute girls doing cute things in cute ways, which is basically moe, as they do with incest. Seemingly, these are separate categories that should not be confused or mixed.

However, this is not the case for some Japanese otaku to one extent or another. While recent polls show that most Japanese would not commit incest or many of the (criminal) acts shown in VNs and some anime, the fact that a minority would do it can be frankly terrifying. Most Japanese otaku do make a barrier of some sort between 2-D and 3-D, although that line is becoming more blurred as well. Other polls and research have shown that many, if not most, otaku are showing a huge decrease in interest in 3-D women, marriage, and even sex, with the most quoted reason being not wanting to be responsible for such a relationship with a woman who "nags." Hence, it seems that many Japanese men and some women are redirecting their sexual drives and frustrations to the 2-D world, which "allows" for things such as incest, gay/lesbian relationships, etc. Yet, this seems to create a never-ending loop because otaku are more or less seen as social outcasts in a communal society. Admittedly, most otaku are harmless. Even so, when pitted against a cultural stereotype, this just adds to the pressure. Lastly and sadly, many Japanese children have not grown up with a strong father or mother figure around the house, which typically creates its own set of problems, including social awkwardness, mental illness and disorders, abuse towards others later in life, feelings of abandonment and anger, being unable to have successful relationships with the opposite and/or same gender, being unable to relate to children, feelings of inadequacy, being unable to be successful in one's career, etc. While some of these things may feel like a long shot from being the source of the trend, I think that there may be some sort of lingering correlation between them.


i might be an exception amongst my nation's general populace with their thoughts, convictions, and standards, but imo incest can be a good thing, AS LONG as its in unglorified 2D. 3D manifestations of incestuous romance and marriage are out of the question, and that doesn't even factor in how incest can be a criminal offense in many nations. though, IDEALLY (and this is my very personal opinion), if one were to look only on the evolutionary ultimatum against incest, which could be said as the origin of the social taboo, incestuous lovers ought to be given the chance to belong in society like your typical man and wife, AFTER agreeing to not contribute to the gene pool (some sort of social contract that binds incestuous couples to sterilization as well as being banned from artificial conception methods that might be developed in the near future). then again, no nation and constitution has even come close to such an idea, and probably never will.


We have to keep in mind that many nations have based their laws on religious standards, especially the United States and (parts of) Europe.
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby shichinanatsu » Thu Jul 04, 2013 1:05 am

ainsoph9 wrote:Like you said, I do not mind the over- and undertones too much, although it gets quite old too quickly. The blurring of the lines between incest and moe seems to be problematic on one level or another. Obviously, from a moral perspective, especially a Western one, this is a big no-no. Westerners do not have as nearly as much of a problem with cute girls doing cute things in cute ways, which is basically moe, as they do with incest. Seemingly, these are separate categories that should not be confused or mixed.

However, this is not the case for some Japanese otaku to one extent or another. While recent polls show that most Japanese would not commit incest or many of the (criminal) acts shown in VNs and some anime, the fact that a minority would do it can be frankly terrifying. Most Japanese otaku do make a barrier of some sort between 2-D and 3-D, although that line is becoming more blurred as well. Other polls and research have shown that many, if not most, otaku are showing a huge decrease in interest in 3-D women, marriage, and even sex, with the most quoted reason being not wanting to be responsible for such a relationship with a woman who "nags." Hence, it seems that many Japanese men and some women are redirecting their sexual drives and frustrations to the 2-D world, which "allows" for things such as incest, gay/lesbian relationships, etc. Yet, this seems to create a never-ending loop because otaku are more or less seen as social outcasts in a communal society. Admittedly, most otaku are harmless. Even so, when pitted against a cultural stereotype, this just adds to the pressure. Lastly and sadly, many Japanese children have not grown up with a strong father or mother figure around the house, which typically creates its own set of problems, including social awkwardness, mental illness and disorders, abuse towards others later in life, feelings of abandonment and anger, being unable to have successful relationships with the opposite and/or same gender, being unable to relate to children, feelings of inadequacy, being unable to be successful in one's career, etc. While some of these things may feel like a long shot from being the source of the trend, I think that there may be some sort of lingering correlation between them.
Spoiler! :
you could say the "evil" that corrupts otaku would be that their chosen poison (anime/manga/LN/VN) is pretty much a concentrated/distilled form of wish fulfillment, which is an oxymoron in a way. speaking for VNs, i highly prefer titles when they feature endings where protag and chosen hero/ine, after overcoming challenges alone and together, find means to settle down in adult society, get married and have kids. i mean, which otaku in his/her right mind would not want a taste of the same kind of life, in 3D? of course, such stories so conveniently leave out them parts regarding your average yearly income VS. cost-of-living, real estate and child-rearing, not to mention the practically insane difficulty level attached to maintaining rewarding interpersonal relationships.

i remember a non-sequitur from a statistics professor a couple years back. any sample/population that approximates a bell curve will ALWAYS have an "omega group" of outcasts on either side, i.e. the over- and under-privileged, regardless of metric used. thus the issue in any society that there will almost always be outcasts, no matter how small they may be in number. ideally, society and its outcasts ought to be bound by a joint effort that prevents alienation and/or hostility from each party. however, for a society and culture that puts the community above the individual (japan), such outcasts will by default be at a disadvantage since a sufficient amount of power (finances, influence, talent) is required to offset disadvantage. fine if you're filthy rich, well-connected, gifted. bad if you're ridden with sickness/disability, on or below subsistence level, subscriber to a not-exactly-agreeable school of thought/theological conviction/sexual preference.
ainsoph9 wrote:We have to keep in mind that many nations have based their laws on religious standards, especially the United States and (parts of) Europe.
Spoiler! :
highly tempted i may be to post a wall referring to religion's ire with incest as i'm against theism in general, i'll refrain.. :mrgreen:

i always thought that the otaku culture's fixation with the ani-imouto incestuous romance is rooted in Shinto creation myth featuring Izanagi and Izanami... or might i be mistaken?? either way, that might be behind their leniency on the taboo in general. so happens this thought came from the guy who started me on my journey as an otaku, and he even raised a particular interpretation of the Abrahamic creation myth that favors incest: Adam and Eve being either father-daughter and/or brother-sister. :twisted: 8)
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Re: Anime Culture Shock

Postby dalek » Mon Dec 28, 2015 10:36 pm

I find this is utter gibberish. Jffkffgfghvgvgv culture shock fgygckygghc protagonist gyfuyfhjghnggf more gibberish. No need to clarify.
Spoiler! :
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Open the spoiler, it is the box...
Spoiler! :
Watch it all and you are a box god.

...open the box, my friend...
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