Editing Talk:Hidan no Aria Archived (section)

== Picture Positioning ==

I'd like to discuss and debate about the picture positioning in the light novel chapter parts. Currently the pictures are being placed in such an order as to mimic the light novel position. (ie: text page ends picture page begins). However I believe that this is problematic to be used ''here'' because in reading a light novel one can see the picture page as well as the text page side by side when they open onto that page thus allowing easy comparison between the line and it's corresponding picture. But here, due to the layout being continuous it does not allow the corresponding to occur so smoothly. Instead the reader passes the line that the picture corresponds to and finds the image 10 to 20 lines below that right next to text lines that have either little or absolutely no relation to the picture at all. I acknowledge the argument that this is how the author wished it to be, however I wish to make a point that this was because of the very basic format of all books. No matter what page you open to, unless you fold one side to the back there will always be two pages before you. So I have two ideas to give here:
# Match the pictures' locations to the text lines most suited for them.
# Mark the end of each page with a <nowiki>----</nowiki> to insert a line signifying the end of a novel page(like demonstrated below) and making the pictures bigger so they may seem page sized as well.

----

:3. Make no changes and let the text and pictures remain unmatched.

Wow that's three. LOL. Personally, I believe the first idea is the best even if it does go against the original ordering. Does anyone have any objections and explanations as to why? [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 22:52, 26 April 2011 (UCT)


<s>I'll go with the first option. Initially, I thought that the picture placement was just some kind or bug or error or something. It didn't really occur to me that that was intentional. ;) Anyway, it will help the reader identify the scene and image better, since the picture is placed beside or near the accompanying text.</s>  My ignorance is showing, sorry about that. Anyway, I read (or looked at a page, trying to find a word I know) the source and the images are pretty much around where they are here, the only difference being the format (page-to-page vs continuous). Cross-referenced other series (specifically ZnT) and the editing is the same. So even though it's not spot on, it is how the page is intended w/ the only difference being format. So I guess, 3rd option? [[User:Seyrine|s13]] 16:05, 27 April 2011 (UCT)

I'm not putting the pictures anywhere else. Each author chooses where to put their pictures for a very specific reason. If you think it doesn't correspond well, then minimize a picture of the photo and read it side by side.- [[User:YoakeNoHikari|YoakeNoHikari]] 15:34, 27 April 2011 (UCT)

The OP is not incorrect that you can see the pictures side by side when you're reading it, but I prefer to just put it in at the end of the page, because, well...that's just how I see it. Putting it at the beginning would not necessarily be incorrect, but it's nice to read something before you look at the picture for it, which is the author's intent. - [[User:YoakeNoHikari|YoakeNoHikari]] 17:09, 27 April 2011 (UCT)

What you are saying ''is'' partly true. But only in cases where the picture relating to the text is on the ''backside'' of the related text page. When it is on the page on the side it is obviously there so that the picture and the text could be easily referenced. Even here because of the picture's size it can be made to look as though it is right next to the page. That is what I believe the author's original intention is. I'm not wrong am I? [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 17:16, 27 April 2011 (UCT)

Rather I would say that because of the transition from side-by-side to continuous format the resulting positions of the pictures are something the author had not originally wanted, wouldn't you agree? As such shouldn't we choose from point 1 or 2 and not 3 regardless of how it's being done in the other light novels pages? Isn't it only correct that we do this? [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 19:12, 27 April 2011 (UCT)

Finally from what you have been saying, it seems that you want the format to be as follows:

''text'' '''page1'''<br>
''picture'' '''page2'''<br>
''text'' '''page3'''

but instead it's '''''actually''''' like this:

''text'' '''page1'''<br>
''text'' '''page3''' ''picture'' '''page2'''

'''Note:''' Point 1 would make it like this:

''text'' '''page1''' ''picture'' '''page2'''<br>
''text'' '''page3'''

whereas Point 2 would show it like this:

''text'' '''page1'''<br>
----
''picture'' '''page2'''<br>
----
''text'' '''page3'''

So which format would you prefer. According to this, even the current format is actually against the original author's wishes, isn't it? <!--Sorry about the comment, but it does imply the truth and seemed like a good thing to motivate the discussion. Then again that would actually cut into the translation time. Sorry again.--> [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 12:43, 28 April 2011 (UCT)

give it a few days before concluding that people are not answering. some of us are busy people in RL. besides, not everyone watches the pages, or are able to sift through the flood of "recent changes" to find their object of interest. bring it to the forums in that case. begging your pardon, as a translator, I think this is so trivial that I won't even waste time debating or discussing it. discussing stuff like terminologies such as the butei articles is more constructive than a few image placements, and there are very few indeed; begging your pardon again. if you really want to, you can set up a poll in the forums, but that would only make sense if a lot of people are actually concerned with this topic of interest. whatever the case, the supervisor (or translators) makes the final decision. on a side note, given that this is relatively popular project, nobody posting means no one cares about this? and sorry for my typing because I hate caps hahaha :3 --[[User:Larethian|Larethian]] 13:17, 28 April 2011 (UCT)

No problem. I do understand and it was my intention to wait. Plus the purpose of this topic is to persuade the editors and as stated in my previous post ''(see hidden text)'' the comment was just for motivation and I apologized to those who would take it the wrong way, finally I didn't actually say anything wrong, only laughed ''(evilly yes but only laughed)'', LOL. Besides, if my intention was not to persuade through discussion and debating the issue I wouldn't have started this in the first place. Trivial, it might be on face, but I still think it is worth discussing because of it's deeper implications. Plus if nobody cares doesn't that mean that any format is applicable? I think that is wrong, which is why I wish to confirm others views on this. [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 13:46, 28 April 2011 (UCT)

I didn't say that you are saying something wrong. It's just my opinion that it's a trivial thing, just as it's in your opinion that it's important. Different opinions that's all. No right or wrong. --[[User:Larethian|Larethian]] 14:06, 28 April 2011 (UCT)

True. [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 18:49, 28 April 2011 (UCT)

Yes indeed. Going over the previous posts I see that this is indeed a difference in opinion. Clarity is indeed needed. My opinion is that of a single reader, what's yours? Oh and we might need other readers' opinions as well, after all I am not the only one or a representative of all the readers. No, not at all. Thus more input from both sides would be appreciated. [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 21:42, 28 April 2011 (UCT)

Hmm... I wouldnt see any reason to do it different as it is done in the other translations... - aka text page / picture page / text page, but if you like you could put the corresponding line also under the picture (like it was done for Haruhi) to get a matching effect... --[[User:Darklor|Darklor]] 01:08, 29 April 2011 (UCT)

Yeah that is being done here and there. But it still feels weird to scroll down a whole screen or two just to get to the picture that matches the text, especially when in the book the text-picture pages are side-by-side '''(See the layout example a few posts back for details)''. ''(After checking)'' See, the picture's still side-by-side even here, just with the wrong text page, so to speak. I'm proposing we correct that. The journey of a 1000 miles starts with the first step but if we don't take the first step how will the journey begin? So why not take the first step when the result is an improvement? If it's a problem of time consumption while revising previous chapters then can't you let me take care of that detail. That way the translators won't have to stop their work. I can do it all within a few hours, albeit a bit roughly in the cases where the picture does not have labels. But even so. It's actually better than setting it next to the wrong page start. As said before I believe setting the picture, next to the page, after the one it is meant for (ie:

'''page1''': ''text''<br>
'''page3''': ''text'' | '''page2''': ''picture''

) is not how the author wished it, though this is just my view as a reader. But it does hold some water, no? We could even switch the ordering around to make it even closer to the original format like so:

'''page2''': ''picture'' | '''page1''': ''text''<br>
'''page3''': ''text''

What do you think? Oh and the offer, of me doing it if translators too busy translating, still stands. [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 01:50, 29 April 2011 (UCT)

My opinion: remove the stupid text under the pictures and "Match the pictures' locations to the text lines most suited for them." 

That's how I do it for every series [[User:Vaelis|Vaelis]] 07:53, 29 April 2011 (UCT)

I'm not too busy translating, I'm too busy reading other things. Just because I translate this fanatically doesn't mean I don't have a mountain of other things to read/watch. As it stands, I'm practicing my Japanese by reading Mayo Chiki!, which is kind of a weird order, but that's irrelevant.

My opinion: I don't care enough to argue about it. If you're so horribly against putting it down there, then change it, but as I translate, I'm going to keep doing it the way it is currently. If you want to change it, then just do so after I put it in. - [[User:YoakeNoHikari|YoakeNoHikari]] 18:09, 2 May 2011 (UCT)

That's fine with me. So to confirm, I can set the picture next to the related text while revising and there won't be an edit war over it, right? Cause that's really scary. This one time... Oh well that's... well, forget that. Anyway, I have permission to match text with pictures while revising, right? [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 22:36, 2 May 2011 (UCT)

Well, can I? Can I? Can I? Pleeeease? ''(Hoppity, hoppity, hop)'' [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 18:42, 3 May 2011 (UCT)

At this point, I couldn't care less. If such a trivial thing irks you so badly, then by all means, go ahead and change it. I certainly won't be wasting time and effort to change it back. - [[User:YoakeNoHikari|YoakeNoHikari]] 19:05, 3 May 2011 (UCT)

Thank you! (Nyari) [[User:Zero2001|Zero2001]] 19:14, 3 May 2011 (UCT)