Editing User talk:John Woodward (section)

====Vanant====

Hey, though I don't know how much longer I'll be doing Mushoku Tensei, just for future reference in case I do happen to translate more chapters, things like

Chr○tians =/= Chrostians

It's a circle that Japanese use the way we use #$% or **. If you feel that it's too easy to mistake as an 'o' (I personally don't feel this is the case at all), feel free to replace it with a bigger circle i.e. 〇

If you were already aware, but felt like uncensoring it, I'd like to remind you that as the translator, I'm the one who decides how best to convey the original author's meaning in English, and as an editor you should consult me first. 

Cheers. Also, although I don't think you're wrong (I haven't changed them back), why do you put spaces between the dots for ellipses? I'd like to know for future reference. 

EDIT: Are you planning on going through every volume and changing it like this? Speaking frankly I feel that the spaced ellipsis looks kind of stupid, probably because noone else uses it (even if that's proper and how you were taught), so if you dislike the simple '...' could you replace it with a precomposed one instead, like '…' or '...'? 

FURTHER EDIT: Like legit, it's like the stupidest looking thing I've ever seen. I'm actually naturally getting more aggressive in my speech towards you because it just looks so incredibly stupid looking. Also it might be different to you, but I've been taught that ellipses are supposed to be stuck to the end of the final letter, like so..., and not like this ...

Additionally, please watch out for the formatting on wiki pages. What happens when you start a line with a space is this: http://www.baka-tsuki.org/project/index.php?title=Mushoku_Tensei:Volume_08_Chapter_4#Part_3

Cheers :P

ANOTHER EDIT: Nup, sorry. I broke. I can't stand it. I can't leave it. Since you apparently hate the '...' that everyone else uses, I've replaced it with a precomposed ellipsis that computer dudes have agreed on. Sorry. I know I'm being pushy, but sorry. Nup. Can't stand it. Can't stand it. Can't stand it.

FINAL EDIT: Please take more care when editing, and re-read the sentence a few times to see if you actually understand the meaning. The time that I spend going over your edits and seeing what's correct and what isn't is deducted out of the remaining time I have to translate. For example, I probably won't get my final chapter done tonight because of this. I've clearly left on my profile page rough copies of the translation that are lined up against the raws. If you find a sentence to be odd, and don't understand the meaning, by all means have a look at the raws first and see if you can reword it so that it's more clear.

[[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 02:31, 27 July 2014 (CDT)

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Hmmph! As long as you understa- hahaha nah, just kidding. Sorry for saying it the way I did; it was way out of line. Just pretty stressed because I'm going back to uni today (and I hate uni) and was trying to get a few chapters done before it started again. Honestly it didn't take that long to revise, and I was just venting unfairly on you because the other hindrances yesterday couldn't be helped. Sorry again, and thanks for being so understanding.[[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 20:19, 27 July 2014 (CDT)

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Chapter 132.5

A few examples of what I'm unhappy about:

"This place that was presently the headquarters of the Sword God Style had seen for a time the prominence of the Water God Style."<br />

"This place, that was presently the headquarters of the Sword God Style, was the prominent Water God Style."<br />

^ meaning, 'had for a time seen the prominence/rise/golden-age of the Water God Style'<br />

"That Water God himself had been defeated by another Sword God and the Holy Land returned to the hands of the Sword God Style."<br />

"Another Sword God had defeated that Water God himself and the Holy Land returned to the hands of the Sword God Style."<br />

^ meaning, 'that certain Water God who had taken over the Sword God Style's headquarters was himself defeated by the next generation of Sword God'<br />

"However, since this place became the place where the strongest swordsman of the generation would stay here and teach the sword."<br />

"However, this place became the place where the strongest swordsman of the generation would stay here and teach the sword."<br />

^ my bad, was meant to be 'since then'<br />

"If possible, defeat the strongest swordsman and then become the strongest yourself."<br />

"If possible, defeat him or her. Then, become the strongest yourself."<br />

^ badly worded, but the implication is that you ARE the strongest the moment you kill them. After all, that's how the title Sword God is passed along.<br />

"Honestly speaking, she was the Water God 『Reyda Liia』 after all. Mastering the Water God Secret Art 『Sword of Deprivation』, she was one of those who could be called the 'strongest swordsman'."<br />

"She was the Water God, 『Reyda Liia』. After mastering the Water God secret art 『Sword of Deprivation?』, others called her the 'strongest swordswoman'."<br />

^ the Japanese text actually said "honestly speaking". I'm not making this shit up because I think it sounds better.<br />

"Though she was currently dressed as a traveller, were her clothes different, she would look just very much like the type of person who could be found sitting in a soft chair, knitting or embroidering something."<br />

"Though she was currently dressed as a traveler, were her clothes different, others might possibly find her sitting in a soft chair, knitting or embroidering something."<br />

^ badly worded since someone posted this without my permission (before final edits), but should be "wouldn't look out of place sitting in a soft chair, knitting or embroidering something."<br />

"Even the townsgirls here and there with their slim arms were more possibly skilled than burly adventurers."<br />

"Even the town’s girls here, with their slim arms, were more skilled than burly adventurers were."<br />

町娘. Point is that they're typical girls raised in a town, i.e. townsfolk except girls. We don't have an equivalent in English, so I went with 'townsgirl' since I occasionally see it used (even if it isn't a word).<br />

"When she noticed them, she immediately threw away the bucket and moved her hand to the sword at her waist in vigilance."<br />

"When she noticed them, she immediately threw the bucket down and moved her hand to the sword at her waist in vigilance."<br />

投げ捨て. Threw away. Suteru is to abandon. It really means 'throw away', as in to discard or abandon. Professional translators have translated the compound as 'thrown away'. It's not 'thrown down'.<br />

"And that the woman next to her was as strong as, or perhaps stronger than Nina was.<br />

"And that the young woman next to her was as strong as, or perhaps stronger, than Nina’s strength."<br />

^ awkward and unnecessary change<br />

"In this world, the was only one who could boldly declare themselves Reyda Liia. They were the top of the Water God Style. Only the Water God called herself Reyda Liia."<br />

"In this world, only one could boldly declare herself as Reyda Liia, the top of the Water God Style. Only the Water God called herself Reyda Liia."<br />

^ wording is just as awkward, except now you've strayed from the Japanese text. i.e. made it worse<br />

"Typical of snowy-climate countries, the genkan <nowiki><ref>ED: A front porch? </ref>"<br /></nowiki>

If you don't know what a genkan is, how about google it and not write a @#$#ing stupid reference note? No, it's not a front porch. It's a genkan. Only Japanese (and some Japanese influenced places like certain Taiwanese) houses have it.<br /> It's because the outside is dirty, like shit, so they don't wear shoes in the house. The genkan (lit. entrance) is a space to take off shoes and store them before entering the house.<br />

"A little distance behind her sat Nina who seemed to be waiting, and the woman Reyda had brought along."<br />

"A little distance behind her sat Nina, who seemed to be waiting, and the young woman Reyda had brought along."<br />

女 ← enlighten me. Where do you see 'young' here?<br />

"However, were it only for such a reason, she wouldn't have come all the way from the Aslan capital."<br />

"However, were it only for such a reason, she wouldn't have come all the way from the Aslan Capital."<br />

^ you don't capitalise 'Capital' in these cases. Aren't you an editor?<br />

"she had gotten a little carried away."<br />

"she was a little carried away."<br />

^ for one thing, yes, past perfect makes sense here. It makes less sense without it. For another, you "get carried away", you don't "carry away".<br />

"Sword God Gull Farion would be cause for great gains in EXP."<br />

"Sword God Gull Farion would cause great gains in EXP."<br />

^ uhh?<br />

"Moreover, Reyda thought that Gull Farion was thinking the same thing when he called her here. His disciple would cross swords with the Water God Style, and tasting the Water God counters with their own body, they'd be able to growth, she thought."<br />

"Moreover, Reyda thought Gull Farion was thinking the same when he called them here. Gull Farion’s disciple, Eris, would cross swords with the Water God Style- tasting the Water God counters with her own body. And thus, they'd both be able to grow, she thought."<br />

^ no mention of Eris. At this point she still thinks it's Nina. Now you're actually changing the story. Thanks.<br />

"The aim behind those words was to have Nina take her disciple down a notch."<br />

"The aim: to have the young girl humble her disciple."<br />

^ Thanks for choosing my words for me, dickhead.<br />

"That's fine. Nina, call Eris here."<br />

"That's fine. Nina, call her here."<br />

^ Wow. Keep making changes to your taste, please.<br />

Anyway, it's already midnight, I have to get up early tomorrow, and I still haven't finished the assignment due for tomorrow so I only got halfway through your second edit before giving up. I'll look at the useful stuff later when I can be bothered, and... Sigh. I was originally planning on saying something like

''"Since Sallisslights uploaded this, I'm not going to blame you since you didn't know the translator was me, the picky douchebag",''

but the further I read into your edits, the angrier I got at how 勝手 you were with it, and how much more time you bloody editors waste than save, so from now on I'm either going to tell editors to stay the @#$# away from my translations and edit things that are actually @#$#ing Engrish (do you guys not see Volumes 4~6, 16~19?) and stay the @#$# away from stuff I've written myself. It's not perfect, but I'd rather get readers on my deviantart or my friends to read over it and edit it myself than have termites eating away at it out of my sight.

I'm actually getting pretty tired of this, which is why I've lost so much motivation to translate (and have taken so long to do volume 13), but I'm about a hair's breadthe away from quitting translations and just TLC-ing stuff already out there.

And no, I don't care if my words discourage editors. There's a whole mountain of you guys anyway.

Thanks again. [[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 09:16, 17 August 2014 (CDT)

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Umm, so this is going to sound insincere since I'm a repeat offender, but I'm really sorry at lashing out at you. I've just been quite busy recently, and since there are few consequences on the internet, whenever my inhibitions lower (usually 2~3 AM in the morning when I'm up doing homework) I sort of get really touchy and rage at whatever sets me off.

Now that I've woken up (it's 9AM), I'm pretty embarassed at what I said. I can tell you've put a lot of effort into the edits, and no, I'll be personally going through them all to edit the chapter before re-posting it. Though I do stand by the fact that you've been a bit liberal with some of your edits (you've misunderstood quite a bit), I'm sure that can be fixed with increased communication.

I really do appreciate the work you've done (when I'm not being a grumpy little faggot), so I hope I haven't discouraged you from anything. [[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 18:03, 17 August 2014 (CDT)

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Oh shit. Actually I just realised that someone deleted the page. Right, um... Well, I '''will''' get around to editing, and once I do, if you're still up to it, please feel free to make edits. Just, um, give me a heads up when you do so I can look over them for any examples of miscommunication. I '''do''' tend to be rather verbose in my writing style though, so please do have a bit of a closer look at the meaning before simplifying it (and possibly misinterpreting it). Cheers. >< [[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 18:09, 17 August 2014 (CDT)

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Hey! I think he was just doing me a favour by deleting the page. (: I'll be editing it tonight and then posting it up. If the wording of final chapter versions is a bit awkward, it's usually because I'm trying to preserve some implication that was in the JP. Still, it's not like I always come up with the best way of wording it. If you're still willing to put in the effort, by all means leave me a list of changes you think would be good. [[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 04:04, 18 August 2014 (CDT)

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John! Thanks for the edits, and sorry again for the other time. For the tenses, I mostly stick to exactly the tenses that the author himself has used. That said, I don't know how it is in Japanese (I don't have much experience with reading JP novels), but the tense jumps have always bothered me. I personally prefer all side stories (and stories without Rudy's monologues) to be in past tense (the way I did the side stories), but certainly in the original text the side stories as well used a mix of present and past tense. 

I always felt that using past-only was satisfactory, since it'd be a sort of 'side story' that didn't focus on the main character himself (the view we take is of an omniscient 3rd person narrator), but if you feel you can make improvements to the tense, please go ahead. I'm quite picky with wording since I'm the one doing the translating, but I definitely don't claim to know better about tenses (often present tense stories in JP are translated to past tense stories in EN). Someone better at storywriting than me should decide on that. [[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 17:19, 19 August 2014 (CDT)

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Yeah, it's really good! Thanks! For chapter 127 I followed the tense of the original to the letter (because it would've taken up too much time to consider it while translating), but again, I don't know if it works in Japanese, but the tense jumps DO NOT work in English. I think you've done a great job with the tense changes. We may be taking some liberties, but seriously, all that tense jumping shit is just horrible. Even in the same scene he changes tense like 80 times. [[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 22:56, 19 August 2014 (CDT)

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John, just note that this author writse pretty casually. It's not written in the same way as the novels you might be used to. For example,  	

''I see, so that's why he was having a tryst with his lover(doll). Since it was such a rare occasion, I wonder if I've done something bad.''

''I see, so that's why he was having a tryst with his lover, the doll. Since it was such a rare occasion, I wonder if I've done something bad.''

The author actually writes lover(doll). This isn't something unique to Japanese. It's just the way it's written, lol. I've told you that I'm fine with you changing tense, but if you start to touch "grammar" without checking the source material, then... You know? [[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 02:35, 21 August 2014 (CDT)

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And again, please don't make haphazard edits. 

'thine/thy' = modern 'your' (singular)

'mine/my' = modern 'my'

[[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 02:37, 21 August 2014 (CDT)

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"Please raise your head, for a prince of a country to, to me, it's too much, what if someone sees!?"

"Please raise your head, for a prince of a country to… to me, it's too much, what if someone sees!?"

^ incorrect. Sometimes if the grammar doesn't make sense in a dialogue, it's not supposed to.

[[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 02:42, 21 August 2014 (CDT)

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Goodness. Lucky for me, I noticed your edits early today. Had I found them at 3AM or something, when I have a test tomorrow, I might have said something embarassing to you again, lol. Well whatever. I'll have a look at it on Saturday when I have time. Please don't make further edits outside of tense changes. [[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 02:44, 21 August 2014 (CDT)

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And I thought I told you to message me whenever you made major edits to the chapters I translated? :/ I'm angry right now not because you made incorrect edits, but because I might never have noticed you making careless mistakes with the scripts. I refresh 'recent changes' when I'm procrastinating, but you can hardly expect me to always do so, can you...? [[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 02:51, 21 August 2014 (CDT)

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Well, if you did tense only, it might be less of a waste of energy for you each time I change one of your less perfect edits back. But mn, the biggest issue is that I just want you to leave me a message telling me that you've edited a chapter, and that I should go check to make sure there's nothing that's been mistakenly changed, that's all. As I've said, I usually do reword every single line in the chapter at least 2~3 times (some many more times), so in general I'm pretty happy with the words I've chosen myself (for whatever reason I may have). Still, I'm not going to deny that some parts of each chapter are done when I'm dead tired, it hasn't been done in the best way possible.

tldr;
:1. I'm usually very happy with my wording, and if you think "Hm. This looks awkward. I could word it like ''this'' instead.", just keep in mind that it's very likely that I've worded it like that (and not the way we would typically in English) for a reason.
:2. When you do change anything besides CM→US spelling, or the tenses, please leave me a message so I know to have a look when I'm free.

Cheers (:

PS: Oh, and as for "I see, so that's why he was having a tryst with his lover(doll). Since it was such a rare occasion, I wonder if I've done something bad."

The reason it's not "his lover, the doll" is because the Japanese can be taken in two ways.
:1. "I see, so that's why he was having a tryst with his {{Furigana|lover|doll}}. Since it was such a rare occasion, I wonder if I've done something bad."
:2. "I see, so that's why he was having a tryst with his lover('''read''': doll). Since it was such a rare occasion, I wonder if I've done something bad." ala the English joke/casual speak.

[[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 05:07, 21 August 2014 (CDT)

Ah, cheers.  !--- Ed: I left the “neither wielding a sword nor battling is a game” edit as it seems much clearer than it previously was---> was a typo lol. Also I made two minor edits. 

!--- Telling me to replace “me” with “I”---> Mn?

Anyway, thanks for the heads up. (:

EDIT: Ah, and it's not "went on to become" but "would go on to become" because I've written it so that the speaker is in the future, speaking about the events with the year 425 AD as a starting point.

e.g. The next year, he wrote two: A Giraffe and a Half and The Giving Tree, the latter of which would go on to become Silverstein's most popular book. Besides being ...

e.g. Pablo Picasso - Birth (TV-14; 00:57) On October 25, 1881, painter Pablo Picasso was born in Malaga, Spain, and would go on to become one of the founders of ...

e.g. "Lose Yourself" would go on to become the longest running number one hip hop single. However, the song was not performed at the ceremony, due to Eminem's ...

e.g. This she, Mrs Anne (née Flinders) Petrie (1812–1892), accepted on behalf of her young son, William Matthew Flinders Petrie who would go on to become an ...

It has the effect of sounding less like an impersonal historical timeline, and more like a historical epic.

[[User:Vanant|Vanant]] ([[User talk:Vanant|talk]]) 18:41, 21 August 2014 (CDT)