On a Godless Planet:Volume3A Chapter 18
Chapter 18: Party Quiz[edit]
–When’s the wisdom getting here?
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Irish mythology had no creation myth.
Kido saw Kuwajiri-san nod at that assertion. And when Kido looked over at her…
“Yes. There are a few different reasons for this.”
Kuwajiri-san took a breath before continuing.
“First, Ireland and the rest of the British Isles were converted to Christianity by the Roman invasion. So anything related to creation in their myths was overwritten by Genesis in the Bible.”
And…
“Second, Irish mythology was a later mythology and, due to the intense territorial wars, it focuses more on newer stories of heroes than older things like creation .”
“But those don’t apply to the original version, right?”
“Right.” Kuwajiri-san nodded. “And yet the original Celtic culture, and its mythology of a hunting people, also had no creation story or creator gods.”
●
“U-um, what do you mean?”
“The idea is that, because the original Celtic culture had no concept of creation, Irish mythology also lacks it.”
“But,” added Kido.
“Irish mythology has myths that have their origins in Celtic culture but do not end there. That is because the Celtic people who migrated to Ireland began to settle down even as they continued hunting and grazing, their population grew, and they became their own great power ruled by a king and such. And…”
“And that is where I come from.”
“So Irish mythology has a mother earth goddess of a specific region not found in the original Celtic mythology?”
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“It’s a tricky topic. To create that myth, their original social structure had to change and the collection of stories had to gain a narrative. But after their hunting-focused society changed, it’s hard to say they were even the original Celts anymore.”
“Do you see now why discussing ‘Celtic mythology’ is such a pain?”
“”It surrrre is.”
“Shinsei? That’s because of you.”
●
I wanted to ask something even if it was a bit off topic.
“So what did the Celts and Scythians do for the aspects of a mother earth goddess other than the ‘earth’ part?”
“They did have gods in charge of the aspects necessary to support their society.”
“For the Scythians, the bustiness of the mother earth goddess must have been handled by Kido-senpai!”
Oh, I realized.
“Didn’t Herodotus say it was Kido-san who gave birth to the Scythian king?”
“That story resembles Greek mythology, so I think it was created after the Scythian social structure changed and they gained a ‘state’.”
Kido-san sounded a little troubled, but she soon recovered.
“I provided the divine right of kings by having the king be the child of a god, but it was a goddess called Argimpasa who was in charge of motherly love and life.”
“She’s the one Herodotus compared to Aphrodite, right? That’s our goddess of love and beauty who was born from a severed dick.”
“Aunt! Aunt! No one asked you tell them that!”
“What’s this? Trying to compete with Shinto as an underground mythology?”
“Is that a competition you want to win?”
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<There is a theory that Aphrodite’s birth was an invention of Hesiod, who was an extreme misogynist. In fact, to prevent contradictions, she is given a different origin in the family tree.>
“And in Ancient Greece, the Aphrodite defined by Hesiod was called Aphrodite Urania and the other Aphrodite was known as Aphrodite Pandemos to distinguish between the two.”
“What was the difference!? The size of her boobs!?”
<I want to call you an idiot for that, but unfortunately, that is a distinct possibility.>
“I-it is?”
“I would really prefer not to discuss this further, but the Urania one was so defined by Hesiod’s misogyny that she was reduced to nothing more than ‘spiritual love’. Whereas the Pandemos version was a god of ordinary beauty, love, and fertility. She is even the patron goddess of prostitutes.”
“Then count me on Team Pandemos!”
●
Anyway, we needed to get back on topic. Which meant the Scythian warrior state.
“So they had a concept of love and beauty?”
“Yes. That said, Argimpasa is a somewhat unusual goddess.”
“…”
“Now I’m worried where this is going.”
“The thing is, while Argimpasa is a goddess, she has the face of a human with the body of a fish.”
“Yet another bold design.”
“That’s the opposite of our human body with a fish face.”
<It sounds like a joke, but there have even been medals or coins showing that image with her name written in Greek. That suggests it was a common depiction of her.>
“Not to worry! You can have a child with a fish in Shinto!”
“What kind of competition is this supposed to be?”
“Anyway,” said Kido-san. “There is even a theory that the concept of mermaids began with Argimpasa. Maybe it came from the fertility of fish, but she is also the goddess of life and death.”
“…”
“A human-faced fish goddess of love, fertility, life, and death? That seems like a lot for a single god.”
“…”
“Oh, the newcomer can’t handle it all! But don’t worry! You’ll learn to handle it in time!”
“That’s not very reassuring.”
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“Because fish goddess Argimpasa controlled life and death, the Scythians thought the land where the dead slept was underground or below the water.”
Huh? I thought.
“I heard before that there were aspects of Scythian culture that could be seen in Japan too. Is Shinto’s Yomi being an underworld ruled by the goddess Izanami part of that?”
“The realm of the dead being underground and ruled by a goddess is true for us too. My sister rules the underworld.”
“Yeah… And you kept causing her a lot of trouble.”
“Our underworld is Helheim, which is ruled by Helko-chan.”
<You could call this mythological homology or convergent evolution, but there are signs of these things having the same origins and there are theories about how cultural migration affected these myths.>
“What about Egyptian mythology?”
“Our underworld is ruled by Osiris, a male god.”
“Oh, so it isn’t all women.”
“But like Aphrodite, Osiris was originally a plant spirit and controlled the life and regeneration of plants instead of the underworld.”
“Then how did he end up a male god?”
“Well, what other plant gods are there? Oh, I guess there’s you, Shifu-senpai.”
“Yeah, I’m a harvest goddess! Which is all about plants!”
Everyone nodded. And Touto-san nodded in response.
“We already had Isis as a harvest goddess. So with her in charge of that, the people put Osiris in charge of the life and death of plants and made him Isis’s husband.”
“So he was promoted from spirit to freeloader god.”
“After that, the people came up with the legend of Osiris and Isis, which really caught on.”
Furthermore…
“It caught the attention of the Egyptian kings – the pharaohs. As time passed, the pharaohs gained the position of ‘divine incarnations’, but at initially the temple of the sun god Ra, the god of life, had more power than the royal family. So…”
“I think I see where this is going, but go on.”
“Sure,” said Touto-san. “To fight back, the pharaohs said they were the incarnation of Osiris, god of ‘life and death’ which could overturn ‘life’.”
“So in RPG terms, it’s like the royal family becoming dark side necromancers to fight the temple’s light side healers?”
“Didn’t you mention before that the foreign Hyksos made the evil god Set the main god of their dynasty because he resembled their own main god?”
“Those pharaohs were quite something too, huh?”
“Yeah. That’s why we can’t complain too much about the Hyksos.”
“As some additional information I happen to know, the pharaohs later claimed to be the incarnation of Horus, son of Osiris and Isis.”
“Right. Having Osiris and Horus as two generations made things easier when the heir to the throne was still young. That way they could say the previous pharaoh was Osiris and the current one is Horus. Then the heir could receive their divine right from the moment they were named heir. Anyway, starting with the 5th Dynasty at around 2500 BCE, the pharaoh’s power was at its peak and they didn’t want to be bound to any one temple by claiming to be a specific god’s incarnation, so they started claiming to be a son of the sun god Ra. That way they could handle the succession issues without any contradiction.”
“We’re getting into some really complicated history, aren’t we? But to get back on topic, we were discussing why the Egyptian god of the underworld is male.”
“He was originally a plant spirit before being promoted to god status as the harvest goddess’s husband and the pharaohs – who were generally male – claimed to be him, so he was pretty well established as male.”
“Since our dick-born Aphrodite was originally a plant spirit too, you can see how these things can take wildly different paths.”
“It’s like seeing an example of how the people’s lifestyle creates their myths and gods.”
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I see, I thought, deciding to comment despite knowing this was way off topic.
“It’s neat how this touches on the origins of names that show up in Megami Tensei. Isis was also an enemy in Xanadu, but there she’s a crazed god of death, not a harvest god.”
“You’re so lucky you can play that with your 98. We have a 68, so I can’t play any of the games after the jump to 8bit.”
“??? What are you talking about?”
<Game ports to different systems. A perfect example of wholly useless knowledge.>
●
We had gotten off topic, but I had learned something.
“When we were discussing the Celts, I thought Dan-san’s mythology would be strongly influenced by Kido-san’s, but it sounds like you included a lot of new things too.”
“Yes. If anything, we’re more like Norse mythology?”
“Yeah, I can see what you mean.”
“Is that true?”
Shifu-san opened a Revelation Board to answer Kido-san’s question. She called up a map of the British Isles and the European mainland.
“Britain and Scandinavia seem pretty far apart, but check this out.”
The map showed the positions of Scandinavia and Britain.
“If you sail straight west from the Scandinavian Peninsula, you run into Britain’s eastern coast.”
“Right. During BCE times, a lot of people crossed over from the European mainland to Britain, but they didn’t always take the shortest route across the Strait of Dover from France. A lot used a route from Belgium to southeast Britain.”
“From the Roman era to the time of the Vikings, people traveled there from Scandinavia by traveling along the coastal regions or by sailing directly there.”
<The Strait of Dover is only the English name and the it is more accurately called the English Channel. Strictly speaking, the Strait of Dover is only the easternmost part of the channel between England and France. In France, it is known as ‘the east end of La Manche’. And in the Netherlands northeast of France, it is known as the ‘Strait of Calais’. As you can see, the channel has plenty of routes further east as well.>
“Hm? Aren’t the Netherlands pretty far away from there? Even if you do want to cross to Britain from the European mainland, why would you choose to do it from so far away?”
“Because of the tidal currents. They are powerful in the Strait of Dover.”
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Kuwajiri-san raised her hand after Dan-san’s response.
“This relates to my home too, so I’ll provide some more information.”
“Here,” said Shifu-san, tossing over the Revelation Board. Kuwajiri-san caught it and dropped a red color between Britain and France.
“The narrowest part of the Strait of Dover is about 34km, which is fairly wide for a strait.”
“How far is 34km?”
<To use a measurement you can imagine, it is about the width of Tokyo’s 23 wards from east to west. That’s the same distance as from here in Tachikawa to Yokohama.>
“Now I’m even less sure how long it is…”
<It is 9 Mount Fujis.>
“Imagining that made me laugh.”
“Personally, I don’t think that one helps.”
“S-sorry, but since I’m from there, it helped me a lot.”
Why did they all have to give me those weird looks of understanding?
And Balancer continued.
<To look at some famous straits, the Strait of Gibraltar that acts as the Mediterranean Sea’s exit is 14km at its narrowest point. The Strait of Magellan is 3km. There are also straits more than 100km wide like the Bering Strait, but the narrowest is only 9.93m.>
“I thought straits connected seas. Where is that one?”
“In Japan, actually. It’s the Dofuchi Strait between Kagawa Prefecture’s Shodoshima and Maejima islands.”
“Why are they all so narrow?”
“If a strait is too wide, it becomes a sea, not a strait, so it’s only natural for straits to be narrow. And while the Strait of Dover is 34km wide, its deepest point is 68m and its shallowest point is 20m, making it a very shallow strait.”
I could only picture it as a river.
“Come to think of it, wide but shallow rivers have fast currents. But we’re talking about the sea. Why is the current so fast?”
“Because of the tides and terrain differences on a global level. The Strait of Dover has the Atlantic Ocean to the west and the North Sea to the east, but the difference between high tide and low tide is at least 3m and can be as much as 7m.”
“Japan’s three most dangerous straits are Kurushima, Naruto, and Kanmon, but even Kurushima – the worst of the three – only has a tidal difference of 4m.”
“Eh? You mean its worse than the Naruto whirlpools. Twice as bad even?”
“It’s just hard to tell because it’s so wide.”
“It depends on the tides, so think of it as the height of the sea changing. That would mean a tsunami of 3-7m comes and goes in the Strait of Dover at 6-hour intervals. That also speeds up the tidal currents at the narrowest point. That’s why it has long been said to make sure you cross the Strait of Dover within 12 hours after the tide changes.”
<Starting in the early 19th century, people attempted to cross the Strait of Dover in man-powered boats or by swimming, but when you look at the successful routes, they form a wonderful S-shape. Even in the modern day with mechanically powered ships, there are collisions with other ships or the wreckage of sunken ships.>
“Now do you see why people would want to approach from the east instead of using the Strait of Dover?”
“There’s a big gap between Britain and the Scandinavian Peninsula, but even with the rising and falling tides, the current is weak?”
“That’s right. Even if it takes longer than 12 hours and you get pulled back, safety has to come first. The sea between Britain and France was pretty dangerous until the small man-powered boats evolved into big galleys and sailing ships.”
“That’s why Britain has so many sinister spirits related to the sea.”
“I’m learning so much today.”
●
“Anyway, Scandinavia and Britain have interacted for a surprisingly long time, but their myths also have a few similarities.”
“Norse mythology existed in ancient times, but it was rediscovered and compiled in the 10th century, right?”
“More or less. …Irish mythology is similar.”
“Yes. Starting in the 7th century, Christian monks collected and compiled the stories.”
“Hey, Shinsei. Your people did something good for once.”
“Mayyyybe I should rewarrrrd them by tossing them a skiiiined ram.”
“Some people would die of shock if you did that, so please don’t. There is precedent.”
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“Ireland’s stories were mostly gathered by around the 11th century and more discoveries and more compilations were made in the 14th and 15th centuries. That this timing coincides with Norse mythology and the mythologies of other regions probably comes from Christianity trying to find an identity for itself and just the trends of the time. But…”
“The Celtic influence, Christian influence, and the hunting-based culture make them a lot like old friends of ours. You can think of them as a similar generation to us. The biggest difference would be what started this whole discussion: the lack of a creator god or creation story.”
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I nodded at Raidou’s statement.
We were discussing all this to identify the god who had caused the flooding.
“The only real possibilities are a sea god or a creator god. Based on the gods present here, that gives us this list.”
I displayed the list on a Revelation Board.
- Sea Gods
- Poseidon: Olympus
- Me: Game Club (Shinto)
- Mr. V: Teacher
- Creator Gods
- Monotheistic God: Game Club
- Touto: Manga Club
“That should be it.”
“It’s so comforting to see you listed as Shinto!”
“Um, excuse me. I don’t think that’s my affiliation!”
“What, you think you’re still part of Rome after everything you did?”
“Wait, wait, wait, wait. The DC never said anything, so I’m still Rome, I’m still Rome, I’m still Rome. Maybe my temple is on land borrowed from another god and maybe it’s nowhere near the sea, but I’m still with Rome.”
I didn’t see why he was so insistent about this, but maybe it was some kind of homing instinct. So after some thought…
“I will rewrite it if we add anything to the list and I have to display it again.”
“W-will that actually happen?”
“Stop being so suspicious, Mr. V! Who hurt you!?”
“Meeting my first human taught me the world isn’t as kind as I thought it was.”
“Hooray! That means I’m Mr. V’s teacher in life! Don’t worry, Mr. V, I won’t charge you a tuition! But I will task you with guarding me during the defenseless moments when I’m worshiping some big boobs!”
“Won’t that just turn him into Mr. Vomit again?”
“How so?”
“Mr. Vomit protected the human by taking one of the water monster’s water beams to the gut. The damage was too great, so he ended up Mr. Vomiting.”
“Wait, it’s a verb now?”
That gave me a thought.
“Oh, is that what Mr. Vomit meant?”
●
Shifu tilted her head.
“Huh? I guess we never explained that, did we?”
“Hold on! Then what did you think I was!?”
“Excuse me. The many power words everyone has been using are so cursed they seem to have gained a bewitching effect.”
“Huh? But didn’t I explain it?”
<Then let’s take a look back at the idiot’s explanation. This was when you met at Okutama Station.>
“Oh, Mr. Vomit is Mr. Vomit! Because that was my first impression of him!”
“Not often you see an explanation that bad.”
“But Kuwajiri! You’re Kuwajiri, aren’t you!? This is the same thing!”
“And with Senpai-san?”
“Senpai is busty, beautiful, kind, older and taller than me, leans forward a bit when I’m talking to her which makes gravity tug down on her boobs in the most wonderful way, listens to me, talks to me, has a released manifestation that’s like a level above the third-stage transformation in a Sentai show…”
“Shifu-senpai! Shifu-senpai! I’m sorry, but I seem to have hit a switch that triggers a deluge of nonsense!”
“Hey! Wait! I was just getting to the good part! I was going to talk about how Senpai is my main god and include a song praising her non-boob parts!”
What was he even talking about anymore?
“Oh, my. You’re making me blush.”
“It’s hard to believe something like that could produce all these level up Revelation Boards.”
But…
“Anyway, we’ll just keep using Mr. V to refer to Mr. V.”
“We did use that name when speaking with the Olympus gods.”
“Hmm. I still don’t like it, but you may be right.”
●
I thought about the list of names I had produced.
“We have four sea gods or creator gods. I think we can remove Yomoji-san and me from the list, but that would mean either Poseidon or Touto-san is responsible.”
That seemed a little premature. And also…
“The Mesopotamians are here as observers and we can say the same about Irish mythology too, correct? Their sea god does not yet have a real manifestation and they have no creator god.”
“Yes, you can’t cause a flood like this without a sea god or creator god.”
“Right?”
Two hands went up in response to that.
Dan-san’s and Mr. V’s.
Dan-san had gotten hers up first, so I gestured to her.
“Um, we, uh…do have a flood.”
●
“Huh?” was my honest response.
“But you don’t have a creator god or creation story, right?”
“Correct. Irish mythology begins with the people arriving at Ireland. That means the world already existed in the beginning.”
“Then why do they have a flood myth?”
“Well, um…”
Dan-san turned toward a certain god. Namely…
“Huhhhh? Am IIII causing trouble again?”
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